Dear Paul,

Helping a little old lady across the road is a good spiritual technique, which more often than not brings us closer to God as it combats the obstacle of our selfishness. Taking the life of a loved one who suffers and whom we wouldn't like to part with, can also be under certain circumstances a good/religious act. Over time, people tend to forget WHY we do those things, why we take old ladies across the road - we come to consider it a good act on its own, forgetting the real purpose. Nevertheless, most of the time it still works!

I find what's left of the original teachings of Jesus a valuable spiritual resource. It is almost impossible to measure the spiritual effect of a movement on its adherents, a bit easier to look at the personal and social effects. Some of those effects which make me estimate that Christianity has done more good than bad are in the areas of charity, music, family, honest dealings and rehabilitation from crime/addictions. Especially in Australia, only a small minority of Christians follow blindly the dictates of church leaders (and I suspect that most of those would not become great and independent thinkers anyway in absence of their 'holy father'): many Christians in fact shower them with criticism and even change denominations when they do not accept their ideas. Most ordinary Christians use their church as a support-group where they can find like-minded friends for inspiring and supporting each other to do good.

Dear OUG,

First let me congratulate you for improving your style of writing and making it shorter - that allowed me to read and understand your ideas, as I usually skip over your posts.

Religion has as much to offer to atheists as it does to those who believe that God exists (a contradictory and blasphemous idea as far as I'm concerned). While religious theory can be a source of intellectual fun, it is the practice which matters, not the theory!

Dear Yuyutsu.

I have enjoyed our debate here. I'm glade we can have such without the need for personal insult as many on here often resort to when others disagree with them. I learned another concept for religion from you. Thanks.
Now down to business LOL. I must agree any fair minder person would say the basic teachings of Christ (I can only comment on Christianity (Catholic) as that is the form of religion I am most familiar with although much of what I say could apply to other mainstream religions as well, forget the minor sects as I don't know where they are coming from) are good, as I said one can not disagree with the 'Love thy neighbor' type stuff.
The good of religion, yes as you say, "in the areas of charity, music, family, honest dealings and rehabilitation from crime/addictions." Other than the practical side as in charitable works, such as feeding the poor, helping the sick etc. There is the spiritual side the personal relationships, in the way people deal with others, family, friends, business, strangers etc. These good aspects of a persons life may be an extension of their spiritual upbringing due to their christian beliefs and influences the 'Love thy neighbor' stuff. There are many 'good' people in this world who are not religious, that is to say the same outcome can be reached by following another path, Maybe the good people of society are inherently good and would be good no matter what path they followed, religious or otherwise.
Continue.

The bad side of religion in our modern world, I will not hark back to the bad old days of an 'eye for an eye' stuff that has been well documented by history. I will not mention the more recent vile acts of the religious, you known what I mean. The biggest sin of today's religious is their failure to speak out, in the face of injustice, the religious say little, their leadership says little or even openly support injustice, other than "be gooood! your reward will come in the next life." This is by far the biggest failure of the modern religious, it is one thing to feed a man, its another thing to fight for his right to be fed. I could add intolerance and hate for others to the list,but they are more or less caused by the ignorance that some religious want to foster in society, and are very successful at doing so.

thats ok paul
i learnt..athiests hate reading

the next athiests
will be the youtube visionaries

as the old men relive their old dreams..of word/work
and the young get their prophesized 'visions'

yet here it is..

[and i wanted debate/robust exchange of opinion]
little realising..we all have got so much truth/faulsity

if only the youth..could believe the wisdoms
but then..they wouldnt be youth..wouldnt-be learning

..as we had to..
in our youth-time...bit of our life-times

it/is as it is...

we can only change..that within
knowing our enbergies radiate energy
that gets fed on..by other yet other entity/energies

[E cannot be created nor destroyed]

the demons
their energy feeds..
hates spell-ing errors
[they are simple...kiss keep it simple for the sinfull]

that one [athiest religeon]..
you were permitted to read

the other stuff is too dark
for the in the light mob

and too light..for them seeking darkness..

my reading of so many book reading/styles
has perverted..my ability to phrase..a concept
into laymans terms..

in seeking to become
knowledge..able..specialist
becomming an untelligable fool..[so be it]

one concept is all many can bear
im replying on too many levels
but know it ..and it is
as it is..

real time/parrable..
parralel..not poem