One cannot deny religion as clearly it exists and there is much in the psychology of religious belief or faith which is relevant to human beings. I am an atheist and don't see the need but I understand why it is important for some, I only wish there was enough confidence and faith in each faith (so to speak) without the need for denigration or one-upmanship.

It is not belief systems (theist or non-theist) I have issue with but the undue influences on government to bend to one over the other. Most societies are not mono-themed and those that fit closest to that are generally undemocratic, despotic and involve persecution.

Secularism is not a threat to any belief system other than those who are used to having everything their own way. Power is shared in secular states and ensures no-one is persecuted for their beliefs. Freedom of speech allows all views to get an airing as long as we can put them back in the cupboard and resist the temptation to denigrate others for holding a different worldview.

In this contex the Atheist Convention is equally as valid any Catholic, Islamic, Evangelical or Anglican group meets.

Lets hope the Atheists don't add any more evangelism to the mix though there is enough of that to stomach already

pelican,

Live and let live with no undue advantage to any.

That is the core policy of the AFA.

Well said.

David

What makes an atheist? In my case the short answer is the Catholic Church. I was not always an atheist, in fact I have recollection of going to mass for 40 days straight during lent as a 7 or 8 year old, not so much to show God my goodness, but rather to earn a bright shiny holy medal from sister. I recall drinking ‘holy water’ in the belief it would give me magic powers, alas the church failed me there as well, no magic. That’s what little boys in the 1960’s did. The strange thing about me was I was questioning things from an early age, not well received by low ranking functionaries of the church i.e. ‘sisters’ and ‘brothers’. I recall asking ‘sister’ the questions: What is Limbo like? What happened to Jesus’ father St Joseph, did he die? Nor was it the liberal doses of corporal punishment metered out by these low ranking functionaries to one small boy. By my mid teens disillusionment with the church was growing, my pacifist views were not well received by the ‘brothers’. In my 2nd year of high school I refused to ‘volunteer’ to join the school cadet unit this prompted one ‘brother’ to ask “Are you one of them?”” what brother”, “you know…a fancy boy!” My involvement in anti Vietnam War protests (I had an older brother attending Sydney Uni at the time) and my opposition to the Church’s support for the war was the straw that broke the camel’s back. The Catholic Church supported the Vietnam War,
(my post on ‘just war’), we were killing communists and that was a good thing, even if these communists were Vietnamese peasant children, the view of many within the church was a communist is a communist regardless of age, and the only good communist was a dead communist. When I reached an age where I could freely leave the Catholic school system I did and enrolled in a State school to complete my secondary education. (continued).

(continued) Parting words from one ‘brother’ who incidentally I had some respect for, was “Paul1405, I always thought you would make a good Catholic or a good Communist,” my answer to him was “I don’t want to be either brother, just a good person.” All organisations have their rejects, even the Catholic Church

Woot

Saints fan too. What other team would an atheist follow?

And I am consistent, when living in USA followed New Orleans Saints (favourite city in USA). No, haven't been back since Katrina - but is something I must do.

Pelican

>> Secularism is not a threat to any belief system other than those who are used to having everything their own way. <<

Well said.

paul[before ptting my offering upon the alter of public opinion
i will thank our brother woot[but for his persistance...much i put forth wouldnt have gotten said..so woot...your proding made me act..so thankyou

i might as well thank david as well
for the prodding he did last time

anyhow paul..you said..
"" What is Limbo like?""

limbo as many would know
is SUUPPOSED to be the place...decreed by creed
where the unbaptised innocents go..[the church has since decreed there is no such place]

never the less..there is such a place
limbo meand definitivly..the border zone
[the place between heaven and hell]

this is again due to the first law
freewill..[allowing those who have awakend from childhood..to CHOSE..which of the fathers many rooms they CHOSE]

that being said..innocent children
dont go to limbo..they are raised in the highest heavens

in fact..this level of childhood is many fold..from spontanious aborted fetus...being nurtured into babes..to babes develoing into children

as they ask questions..
they are taught the ways of the child
then..if such is their chosing..they MAY decend
to the border zone[limbo]..

to from there
chose to love the light[good]..
or reject the light..and decend..
[as low or as high..as they CHOSE to go]

nothing is fore ordained

to ask is to recieve
not only answer
but proof

you either THEN..chose*..to believe in 'it'
by living it..testing it
or not

either way
its your FREE chosing