The thing that I wonder about with this type of mass killings, is that no one tries to fight back.

Perhaps it's my training in the navy, but I think I'd rather die trying to get the attacker, than semi hide, waiting to be shot. I would think that a few people, acting together, using things like tables to try to deflect bullets to some extent, would be able to overcome a loan gunman.

Having said all that, I of course have no idea how I would react, in the situation, it just seems anything would be better than meekly waiting to be killed.

I sure hope I never find out how I would react, & feel so sorry for those caught up in some ratbags actions.

Thanks for everyone's interesting comments.

I do feel like I understand the issues a little better now.
Waleed's article was very good.

This guy was most definitely a terrorist of the worst degree, and I guess it remains to be seen if he was actually mentally ill or not.

I too hope he is not given a 'pulpit' to preach his message of hatred re labor politics or Islam or whatever his major problem was.

Somehow though, I think the media will make a warped martyr out of this guy, because that makes a better story.

A terrorist is a damn disgusting criminal, no matter what God he/she follows.

Dear Suzeonline,

Governments claim a monopoly on violence. They murder people in many ways. A terrorist is one who goes into business for himself.

Our Australian land was settling by murdering Aborigines. They did it in the service of the monarch. In reading our history I am not aware of anyone who questioned the English right to take land where someone else was living. That doesn't mean that some did not question. I would be interested in learning of such individuals.

Was the settlement of Australia more justified than the crimes of Anders Breivik? He murdered his own countryman. Medals are given for murdering people in other countries.

Dear Hasbeen,

While I did once have three blokes running at me with machetes when I was a teenager (some might say I stood my ground while others that I was rooted to the spot, the truth is somewhere in between) thankfully the nearest I have come to being threatened with a firearm was having a sawn-off shotgun waved under my chin. Very tense for thirty seconds before it was realized it was a case of mistaken identity. The furtherest thing from my mind was attempting to disarm the bloke who was a good deal smaller than me.

All I did was laugh. Absolutely no bravado, just a fear response, although it helped diffuse the situation. When allowed to drive off I had to pull over soon after when the reaction set in. It was all fairly benign compared to what these poor kids went through yet it still puts the hairs up even thinking about it now. What the survivors will carry for the rest of their days is just unimaginable.

I think that without training in those situations the best we might hope for is that we would attempt to help others but who knows.

Dear davidf,

While I note you post is of rather fraught relativism it is something I have been prone to indulge in myself. We will all have a different take on what has happened so I kind of consider this thread as a bit of a therapy session. Therefore as such I'm disinclined to challenge your post.

Dear csteele,

Good to hear from you. I am not quite sure what fraught relativism is. I am in the US at my oldest son's house at the moment and have not been on olo recently.

In countries at war many people can be killed each day, and it's a matter of course. People accept it or don't get overly excited about it.

What has happened in Norway is a horror, but is it any more horrible than what is happening in other parts of the wars where governments are the agents of death?

suzeonline

I am starting - or setting up a Memorial Site. It will take a day. When its ready I will post it here- or we can start a new thread and ask everybody to send their messages from the people of Australia.

Do you want to take it from there? As this is your thread I thought it would be polite to ask.

Kerry