RobbyH you have no right to think for me.
Or to use insults in my name, rechtub knows he disappoints me but other ways exist rather than insults.
Your view has no value for me, it and those who hold such views are an obstruction standing in the way of true reform, more so in my view than rechtubs lost and not shared by many opinions.
I am an active ALP member ex trade union official.
Son of a man who worked himself in to an early grave trying to feed his huge family.
I have eaten pumpkin and potato for tea and the skins for breakfast, those pumkins grew at the back of a rubbish tip.
In all debate I would ask every one to look at who contributes and why.
Some times it is a person who fears honest change may force work on them.
Foxys story about paying for another's food is some thing I have done and would do again.
Can ANY ONE say no fraud exists in welfare? no waste, or that government expenditure need not be checked on?

To have a need for welfare is in itself a sad indictment on our authorities. Why is our system so poorly run that we require welfare in the first place. I tell you why. We don't have an ounce of equality for our tax dollar. Why don't Governments have insurance for people who need help ? Why does it always require a whole department to deal with things ? Why is a portion our tax not put aside for pension ? I think we can never have decent reform until we have a flat tax. Only then can we say we have equality. Welfare on one hand is far too easy for those who are audacious enough But nigh impossible for the decent who need genuine assistance. We seem to have rather generous handouts for Arts but not for victims of Government policy.

I am afraid welfare is a much more complex issue.
A life changing injury can turn any of us to wheel chair bound.
Care and attention for children who have no parents or dysfunctional ones is welfare.
Insurance, seems to be on the surface popular right now, but lets look at it.
Say Queensland's failure to insure its infrastructure.
Few may know the real costs of such insurance, it is more than possible savings came by not insuring.
NSW RTA is self insuring, insurance costs became so big savings came that way.
Like the chances of big events in QLD welfare would bring big premiums.
And every government endeavor seems to bring big bills as bottom feeders charge as much as they can.
What would such insurance cost once we became reliant on it?
Last government, on our behalf , pays from its income sources every thing including welfare.
So the issue is not putting some thing away,, we do that.
It is not transferring the costs to some one else, it can not be done.
It is about managing a problem better.
A problem we have always had and ,without seeking better always will have.
In the end,we all of us, must confront this truth, no government can ever be every thing to every one.
It is far too easy to be critical and to give populist anti every thing statements but answers are harder.

Belly>>Even the dole supports small business cash is cash.

Yes, I agree, but it's the 'cash' that ends up going to the pokies, cigs and grog that I am concerned about.

Remember, welfare is mainly there to support kids.

individual
I hear you loud and clear.

We have now got an entire generation of people who think it's their given right to expect the 'norm' and assume someone else will provide it for them.

RobbyH,
Just so the 'retarded' can also participate in this debate, the 'cash' I am referring to is the cash they can 'withdraw' from their accounts.

Sorry, if I had known the level of intelligence of the participants had dropped so low, I would have better explained myself so you to could also join the debate.

I will try to give you a 'heads up' next time I post. Ok!

ps. Please let me know if there is anything here that you are having difficulty grasping to.

Also, if you want a lesson in 'whit', please feel free to take a shot at the title ya toss!

we can talk about wellfare reform all we like
but till we either stop spending ever more [on war]
or start clawing back that we gave to big business or the rich
by way of bailout and subsidy..nothing can change

http://dailybail.com/home/national-debt-grows-from-13t-to-14t-in-6-months.html

USA/national-debt
grows-from
13t-to-14t..[thats TRILLIONS folks]
ie thousands of BILLIONS
millions of millions
in-6-months

and it all needs to be repayed WITH INTREST
just like in portugal thery are planning ANOTHER bailout
[they cant afford the CURRENT bailouts..so bail em out more]

its like you cant repay your millions
simple we give you credit for billions

you cant afford the INTREST.../ursury..on millions
HOW THE HECK CAN THEY "AFFORD'..the intrest due on billions

we ned to end bailing out the big bailouts
[they keep it and it does change nothing]
but MUST kep bailing out the least[equally]
one pension fits all

those on minimum pension go up to average pension
those on huge pensions come down to average pensions

one bailout for all

big or small
you can only get this
[average bailout]..from govt

anymore is treason*
stealing

or fraud

[if you cant repay..yet lend more]
THATS FRAUD*

rechtub you got a different view out of individuals post than me.
I may be wrong, but saw no defaming of recipients.
And we both know better than to respond as we did to our fire fly, RobbyH is long gone and may only have been a child.
You are quite wrong, welfare is not and never was about mostly children.
Child welfare is a part but so too is disability pensions no small part.
As is unemployment benefits we spend huge amounts on welfare.
If you see the grog in the trolley and it offends you why not tell those who gave the food voucher.
Angry get a dole bludger stuff is rubbish.
Once on mid year annual leave a red neck pair of elderly females spoke loudly of me being out and about on a working day.
I am reminded of them now.
I again ask, can any one say no fraud exists?
And is there one of us who would drop all welfare, subsidized health education transport we spend a great deal and unlike the tea party right I only want to know we do not waste it.