k-M-b: Your hero for free speech, Geert Wilders, is all for making strident comments about Islam and hateful comments about Muslim people in general, but is 'spuugzat'(sick to death-very loosly translanted) about the anti Israel: please note anti ISRAEL, not Judaism, demonstrations that took place in Rotterdam last weekend.

Why is it 'free speech' to express opinions about a whole people and their religion, practised in various degrees, but not to express opinions about a nation state? Why is it 'anti-semitism' to critize or voice concern about what Israel does?

If Wilders was truly a champion for free speech, he would welcome the voicing of opinions different to his own. He doesn't. That's why he is on to his third political party. He doesn't even like listening to the differences of opinions within the most right wing party in the Netherlands.

Anansi,

Geert Wilders is not issuing death threats against the anti-Israel demonstraters.

Please show me where Geert Wilders has made "hateful comments about Muslim people in general".

You are trying to create a false dichotomy between Islamic anti-Israel and Islamic anti-Jewish sentiment.
The sort of anti-Israel demonstrations I have seen on the web are characterised by calls to violence against Jews.
http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=QOyRipFULNY

Perhaps Geert Wilders is 'spuugzat' of the fact that these demonstrations inciting violence are permitted whereas his objections to them are criminalised as "hate" speech.

Damn it all folks. I only got notification of this thread today and I see that Steven and the others have already sent CJ away with his tail between his legs.
I so wanted to give him his third spanking.
I can't deny him his right of 'Freedom to Hide' though.

Antonios, your post http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?discussion=2738#61699 was right on the money. Now with a supposedly leftist government, no-one is screaming out against the government any more. Rudd has declared war on people smugglers - that would be a major crime for Howard. Our troops are still engaged in the Bush wars, as are Obama's. People are still sent to third world holes to be tortured. Nothing changes except the views of the biased public.

"Nothing changes except the views of the biased public."

Not much to that view, what with blinkers, rose-coloured glasses, and their heads in the sand!
"Public Opinion", as real and quantifiable as a puff of smoke, until you upset it!

Unsurprising that Austin Gormless pops up in defence of the haters. No tail between the legs here, old chap - rather a long weekend away from the computer. As happens often, the thread's moved on and I saw little point in going back to the beginning.

However, since you've mentioned it, I note that STEVENLMEYER (I'll return the compliment of shouting his name at him) has been as disingenuous as usual with this thread. He focuses completely upon his presumed right to offend and/or insult anyone on the basis of race, religion or ethnicity, but totally sidesteps that part of the judgement against Toben where the Judge refers to "humiliating" and "intimidating" people on those grounds.

STEVENLMEYER claims not to be interested in the Australia's Racial Discrimination Act - the longstanding law under which Toben was convicted - but claims that freedom of speech is dead because of it. The latest judgement against Toben was brought explicitly due to his defiance of orders made under the RDA, and via a complaint by the Council of Australian Jewry.

If you haters are so upset by this, why don't you agitate to have the RDA amended or repealed? I'm sure it'd suit your agenda and it would certainly be more honest than hiding your hate behind a noble concept like freedom of speech.

Antonios - as I recall, that comment to Col Rouge was in response to some xenophobic prattle or other of his, and was supposed to be ironic. Since English is obviously not your first language, I guess that's why you misunderstood my meaning.

"Damn it all folks. I only got notification of this thread today and I see that Steven and the others have already sent CJ away with his tail between his legs.
I so wanted to give him his third spanking." (Quote: .us........less)

Sorry? What was that? Sorry?

(Antonio: I admire your non-bias in not caring about whether 'nastiness' comes from the so-called Left/Right. But I KNEW that the comment you referred to was a response. Cause and effect. If you ignore the first and concentrate just on the second, you will do little to support those who are the targets of such vitriol. You will assist in enabling those who target them, to flourish.That surely was not your intent?