Do forgive me Banjo for I did not notice your most recent post.

You have a very vivid imagination as to my background. Is this how rumours start? Totally fallacious statements placed on debate forums? Six generations of my family have resided in pastoral and grazing country in Australia. Why do you persist on telling me how to suck eggs?

Yabby, (a blow-in from the Old Dart)and an expert on all matters known to man, who also has a penchant to violate truth, unwittingly and consistently quotes Darwin, a vegetarian!

“Try dealing with the aftermath of dogs attacking a mob of sheep and repeat, that only humans kill for fun.”

Unfortunately Banjo, slow learners or those with a greedy or cruel agenda, fail to acknowledge that these hungry dogs are a result of human action, not least farmers who permit their dogs to go feral.

Nor are these sheep endemic to Australia. They too are blow-ins and their impact on our native life and vegetation has been catastrophic.

You will need to find another scapegoat to justify your promotion of animal cruelty for it is you who wears the lepers’ bell.

With regards to my offers to perform a few surgical procedures, I advise that on reflection, I do not offer you a choice. I offer you the same privileges you grant to defenceless non-humans, which are precisely nil!

Your age, your sensibilities, your gender, your religion, your orphaned children, your inability to suffer extreme pain will be of no consequence. Happily, unlike our marine and terrestrial life, killing you off does not endanger the species!

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/01/07/2460440.htm

http://www.abc.net.au/stateline/wa/content/2006/s2296478.htm

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/01/16/2139576.htm

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2005/08/12/1436395.htm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/6904249.stm

http://www.albany.edu/ihe/salmonstudy/index.html

http://www.thewest.com.au/default.aspx?MenuID=3&ContentID=108710

And for the unenlightened, I offer these words of great wisdom:

“Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect.”

Now what may I expect from the unenlightened? More sneering, more ridicule, more carnage?

Yabby

"That is the problem Bronwyn, they are basically a bunch of spin merchants. Never mind if the information is accurate, as long as it serves the purpose, they will publish, even if mistakes are pointed out to them."

How about we debate the issue at hand, Yabby? Instead of making wild and unsubstantiated claims about PETA’s use of spin and misinformation, perhaps you can actually name some of the inaccuracies in the information it’s provided in this particular campaign. Maybe then we can start to conduct an intelligent debate on the issue in question. And maybe too you might like to present the case for the opposing view, that is, that people have every right to hook and spear fish in the name of sport and recreation. You can be persuasive at times. Have a go at that one. You'll be the first here to do so if you do.

Talking of spin and misinformation, Yabby, is there an alternative to Mulesing, or isn’t there? As pointed out by Dickie, farming bodies are so eager to discredit PETA that they can’t even present a rational and united position. The right hand doesn’t appear to know what the left is thinking, let alone saying. If you’re going to accuse PETA of spreading misinformation, Yabby, you should by rights have your own house in order first.

"Dickie, looking out of your housewifely window ..."

What was the intention of using the word 'housewifely', Yabby?

I know you choose your words carefully, so what was your reason for choosing this one? Apart from a feeble and misguided attempt at deliberate put-down, I certainly can't see any other reason.

*What was the intention of using the word 'housewifely', Yabby?*

Bronwyn, in the past, the truth has come out about Dickie's
practical knowledge and experience about sheep and farming. Zilch.

Living in a mining town, where some pastoralists run a few
sheep, does not constitute experience. She told us what she
knew. She'd looked out of her window as the sheep trucks rolled
by, she had even sat in a pastoralists plane and was invited to
dinner one night. That hardly qualifies Dickie to know much
about mulesing and blowflies, or the sheep industry.

As to Peta's spin, if they use spin and lies in one campaign,
its highly likely that they will do the same in another campaign.
Any organisation which distorts the truth so purposefully,
in my book lacks any kind of credibility.

As it happens, I happen to know a great deal about mulesing,
blowflies etc, from 30 years of firsthand experience. I'm
also in daily contact with a great many farmers, so have a pretty
good idea what they are thinking and why. All Peta have
achieved so far is to insult Australian farmers with distortions
of the truth.

Why on earth should every farmer have the same opinion? Some
farm leaders have their own ideas about the issue, but I know
what most practical farmers on the ground think and plan to do.
The old AWI board found out the hard way, what farmers thought,
but then many of them were not even farmers

Celivia,

'Runner, that God gave us animals is not actually a 'fact''

I grant you that Celivia however it is by far the most rational conclusion. Their is no other rational explanation short of pseudo science.

Bronwyn, Dickie, my regards did you ever think I could keep you two happy?
Poor Nicky has tried yet again to get an animal rights thread started, without luck.
I make no war here I do laugh at PETA, the world does.
And so they should, why do you think animal rights threads are not bringing interested posters?
I think the attack the messenger style is boring people.
I laugh at PETA because it is dumb to try to rename fish, to constantly ignore we need sea food to survive.
I am sickened by the fly blown suffering sheep victims of a group claiming to be animal rights supporters.

“Those of us who have researched extensively … on the drastic environmental impacts of farming commercial animals … would know that PETA are conservationists by default….

Dickie, of course they are conservationists.

“…which of course leads to sustainability.”

No, not necessarily by any means.

All the conservation of endangered species, natural habitats, etc and environmentalism related to farming animals or whatever won’t lead to sustainability if the human population and consequent increasing resource consumption and waste production just continue to grow.

Conservationist and environmentalist are not necessarily sustainabilityists.

“Are you suggesting that PETA, predominantly an animal welfare institute, should change its logo to “Conservationists” and ignore the plight of animals?”

Of course not. In my second post I wrote;

“… I think that PETA should stick to matters of obvious and unnecessary animal cruelty....and address sustainability, as every environmental organisation should “

and

“… an organisation like PETA should be putting a whole lot of energy (at least half of all their effort) into sustainability…”

Regarding PETA’s anti-meat campaign at your first link: http://blog.peta.org.uk/tag/environment;
I don’t see a mention anywhere of the need to reduce the constantly increasing demand for meat caused by a rapidly growing population. PETA appears to be totally happy with the continuously rapidly worsening balance between humanity and nature. They’re certainly not taking a holistic approach to this issue…and consequently they ain’t addressing it with sustainability in mind.

The rest of your links give me the same impression. Crikey, if we eat less meat, the environment will be healthier and we’ll be healthier and greenhouse gas emissions will be reduced….all else being equal. Except that not all else is equal. The number of consumers is rapidly increasing, to the extent that it will greatly reduce any gains won by PETA in their vegetarianism campaign if not cancel out or completely overwhelm it…and yet PETA is apparently having NOTHING to say about this aspect of environmentalism.

They’re not holistic. They’re not sustainability-oriented.