Put me on the Spikey and C J Morgan side of the net.
I will make that mistake a million more times , get the wrong word however I do understand its meaning.
Make no mistake, the claim is a recruiting tool, only fools would not know it hurts more than it helps.
We are past the days that claims like that impressed anyone, why lie? my claim is clearly always stated in exact figures what I expect, it works, both sides should be saying it like it is.
C J Morgan some bosses, this year, came to the table offering 10% for this year.
no broken arms no threats, some openly said we did well over the last 3 years so we want to keep our workers, some good ones are leaving.
Enterprise Bargaining Agreements are just that two sides trading for an outcome both can live with.
Col Rouge your posts make no more since than one under Gods.
I have no doubts some unions must get in contact with reality or die.
We have every reason to be proud of our achievements but none at all not to except the challenges change brings.
Industrial warfare is not the way of the future.
Bosses and unionists are increasingly becoming refugees from radical unionism, good unions are the future not weak just good.

Hi Belly - and a Happy New Year to you.

I knew what you meant, but I chose not to make an issue of it - partly because I respect you and your obvious efforts to improve the way you write, and also because I agree with you.

While ambit claims are an unfortunate historical legacy of the old IR laws, I've always thought that they provide unnecessary ammunition to the 'forces of darkness'.

I've been a proud unionist all my life, and also an ALP member until they lost the plot and became a 'Centre Right' party.

I think we're in total agreement on this issue.

While I want to continue working in the job I was made for I could never put some story's into print.
It hurts, truly , to have to hear constant story's of radical actions that hurt workers,even union members.
Labor has moved to the right, in my view sadly they could not win an election without doing so.
I am proud of union history, most of it, But workers no longer have to hold hat over heart when talking to the boss.
Times have changed, can anyone see a full return ever to pre workchoices IR laws?
Labors laws are not what unions wanted but they are the best we can expect, bosses wanted different laws too.
If a senate acting as an opposition passes the IR laws it will face the test of time, both party's are unlikely to find reason to change them for generations.
Unions who are able to remember the reason they exist is to look after the wages, health safety, wellbeing at work and home of members will be there for the full distance too.
My statement about IR refugees is true, bosses sick of threats, are finding ways to invite other unions into their workplace, even offering bigger wage increases.
Members are not mugs,numbers are changing and radicals actions are not going to hold the refugees much longer.

Belly “Put me on the Spikey and C J Morgan side of the net.”

You do what you want but just remember:

“lay down with dogs,
wake up with an exotic infestation”.

“Col Rouge your posts make no more since than one under Gods.”


But possibly more sense than yours, as I quote the howlers, instead of ignoring them, as I did previously.


However, regarding “I will make that mistake a million more times”


We all do that but I do consider you attitude "quixotic", when you publicly choose bedfellows who have been at pains to point out your incidental and irrelevant "mistakes", over Polycarp and I who, more graciously, ignored them.

Maybe upi have an "internal bias" at work there?


“Industrial warfare is not the way of the future.”

Agree

However, it was never an effective way in the past, only the chosen dogma of those who put their version of the "union entitlements" and an obsessive misconception / miss belief in an inherently immoral claim to dominate contractual negotiations, above the rights of those they pretended to represent.

Arjay: << 80% of our union power is in the public service.If you cannot be sacked and have really good conditions compared to the rest of society,why this ambit claim of 33%? >>

Arjay seems unaware that the claim under discussion is being made by the Construction, Forestry, Mining and Energy Union (CFMEU). I doubt that too many of that union's members are public servants.

Ambit claims by unions in any industry would be unnecessary if employer groups and governments didn't routinely oppose any and all wage claims, and instead came to the negotiating table in good faith. As for unions "dominating contractual negotiations", no doubt the forces of industrial darkness would much prefer it if individual workers were once again deprived of collective bargaining, but fortunately the Rudd ALP government hasn't abandoned its roots completely.

Speaking of howlers:

Troll Scrooge: << miss belief >>

Priceless. What a goose.

Noted Col Rouge but ignored.
I if you read my post history am unlikely to support my side at any price.
While no youth I strongly believe in constant improvement and change.
Long before my conversion to computers, I held the view unions had to change, some of them much more than others.
The idea that unions stand over bosses while once true, of some unions, is no longer true.
Workchoices is still in power, we will see if the opposition remembers why it lost the election within months.
Will they pass the reformed IR laws or divide Australia again.
Rather than the lies about unions find fault with my work last week, Monday major plant hire firm paid no superannuation from June 2008, fixed back payments and warning.
members wife sacked told she will not get $4.000 owing , quote you are not in a union go your hardest, we will fight her case because its wrong free.
Under payment of wages deed of release signed thousands paid.
Visits to 12 lunch sheds to say gday over 1.600 klm traveled.
hardly a crime no blood spilled no trees chopped down, no threats made.