Hmm... I see, so let me think, what appears to be the core point of this thread?

That the 'doctrines' of religions are crucial to being a proper follower, and that interpretation is merely a side point.

Call me cynical, but my suspicion is that polycarp is hoping to draw this toward Islam, cite some section of text in the qu'ran which he will then interpret in a manner he deems appropriate, disregard the fact that the vast majority of muslims are not violent, then proceed to outline why some piece of text from thousands of years old is more valid evidence as to why they are evil, despite the reality today that there's millions of muslims living harmoniously with others.

Of course, were he to do so in the opening paragraph, many people would rightly point out that this dead horse has been well and truly flogged.

Hi Oly :) *smile*

BUGSY... you want to hear more ? :) yikes... ok.. I'll try.

The simple answer to your question about the Crusades is found in Foxy's post.

I have to say clearly that the Crusades were NOT "Christ-ian" wars.

They were wars of State and of an Ecclesiastical network which was enmeshed in the State at the time.
Historically, they were defensive, as the expansion of the Islamic Empire was eroding the territory of "Christendom" i.e.. those places considered part of the 'Holy Roman Empire' (which is an entirely human construct, not Biblical)

In order to raise motivation and soldiers, the Church did indeed use whatever it could to justify the invasions. But I suggest that even if the realm of Christendom was a 'Realm of Zeus' the reaction to the Islamic expansion would have been the same. It would also have been the same if it was not an 'Islamic' empire expanding.. it could simply have been an empire of a different 'god'.

ROBERT you are welcome to criticize me on the basis of scripture, but you have confused 'myth' generated and multiplied by certain individuals with my intent. I could goto the trouble of showing exactly how this occurs, but frankly, that would not change how people wish to perceive me. Call me whatever you like. ISSUES but please don't forget, OLO is more about issues than people.

EVO...you'd choose mine ? :) nah..just read the Bible and find an expression of it's values which suit your personality and understanding.

BELIEF and BEHAVIOR

JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES no blood transfusions.
CHRISTIAN SCIENCE always 'Spiritual' healing first then medical 2nd.
MORMONS "Jesus and Lucifer were brothers"
MANSON FAMILY "Kill the pigs"
HEAVENS GATE "The mothership is waiting.. we must die to meet it"
AUM SHINRIKYO "Saren Gas attack"
SEVENTH DAY ADVENTISTS "worship on Saturday"

Another noteworthy characteristic of JW's is their belief that 'works' save rather than faith. This translates into intrusive door to door "witnessing". If you believe you must 'earn' your salvation, you will obviously 'work hard' to attain it, no?

Hey Polycarp, what part of the Bible did Christ actually write?? He didn't consider himself divine, so why did the early christian(catholic) church elevate him to divinity. Moses would clearly not have agreed. Indeed,to hold tenet in such puerile dogma is actually the antitheseis of the message of Christ.

"but you have confused 'myth' generated and multiplied by certain individuals with my intent."

No David this is not about myth, it's about the obvious conflict between your spin, twists and evasivness compared to the standard of truth which followers of the the christain god are called to. It's not about your intent, it's about your words and actions and those have been demonstrated to be far from honest on numerous occasions.

You don't get it but that does not mean that it's not really obvious to most of those who don't share your evangalise by almost any means beliefs.

You might think that because you have left some wiggle room, a semi-plausable reason why your words my mean something other than their most obvious meaning that you have not born false witness or been deceitfull but I and a number of others take a different view.

Your attempts to deceive and distort in service to your message have no place in someone claiming to follow a god of truth, no place in someone who's god demands plain and honest speech.

R0bert

Interesting ideas there Polycarp. I love the idea that a belief in fairies can manipulate people into acting at their best when in the garden.

Please, go on.

sillyfilly

You are living up to your name by claiming Christ did not claim to be divine. Go back and read the Scriptures before making such absurd or at least come clean with your motive for being deceived or deceptive.

For a start the apostle John called Him God (remember my Lord and my God). Jesus referred to Himself as I am (the same as Jehovah God revealed Himself to Moses). The Jews were so upset they wanted to stone Him. The old testament spoke of Him as being the everlasting Father and Mighty God. Unfortunately space and time would not allow for me to continue to pour water on your silly assertion that the divinity of Christ is a conspiracy theory. By all means choose not to believe the Scriptures but don't mis represent them so blatantly.