"Country Gal.. aaah you need a pinch.. I don't bag Muslims for "trying to convert" I bag them for 2 reasons.
1/ .....
2/ Trying to convert..."

Pollie, them's easy pickin's! Usually trying to trip you up requires too much work for me - slipperier than a certain serpent.

Polycarp,

" actually thought he might be "Wobbles" or one of our other conspiracy theorists.. "

I'll thank you not to use my name in vain.

As for spreading conspiracies and sinister plots, I think I'm way way way out of your league.

You'll believe anything that supports your prejudices and work backwards from there to justify them.

CG.... you missed the finer point of my point :)

"trying to convert" can be a benign activity... it is on WHAT they are trying to convert people TO that the emPHAsis should be.....

You see.. a person can convert to Buddhism..and the next day say "Hmm..I'm sick of this.. I think I'll change to Zoroastrianism" and no-one will do much. Buddhism does not have a death penalty for 'apostasy'...but Islam DOES....and it doesn't matter that we don't see it taking place much but you know as well as I do that the next Sharia based stoning in Nigeria might only be as far away as the lack of international outrage.

Perhaps I should have been more clear...well.. I'll consider myself pinched back :)

Wobbles.. I agree you are wayyyyy out of my league :) and happily so.
You will think you are looking in a mirror is this chap does start writing here

Once more Polycarp,

Regarding apostasy, have you ever heard of something in Mormonism called "blood atonement"? There have been a number of killings over recent years attributed to this concept.

I thought Deuteronomy 13:6 states that the punishment for apostasy is death by stoning or is that referring to unbelievers generally?

Wobbles... please don't confuse the theocratic establishment of the Israelite community with the Church based on the fulfilled Old Testament/New Covenant in Christ.

The only punishment for 'apostasy' is when people meet their creator, though in the interim if a person denies Christ after confessing Him as Lord, I hardly think they would even want to remain in a local Church.

The only overt Church discipline to be meeted out is to those who still claim to be Christians, but who are obviously living a double life and are involved in some act of on going sin.. such as an affair. In such cases, the welcome is removed.

Apostasy is just one side of the coin. When Islam is established you get things like this:

[On March 21, 2006, the Algerian parliament approved a new law requiring imprisonment for two to five years and a fine between five and ten thousand euros for anyone "trying to call on a Muslim to embrace another religion." The same penalty applies to anyone who "stores or circulates publications or audio-visual or other means aiming at destabilizing attachment to Islam."]

If you also recall, there is an Islamic insurgency movement in Algeria which claims the government itself is 'apostate'... go figure.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apostasy_in_Islam#Bah.C3.A1.27.C3.ADs

[More recently, on January 21, 2007, the Central Council of Ex-Muslims was founded in Germany, an association led by Iranian exile Mina Ahadi and Turkish-German immigrant Arzu Toker. The association stands up for former muslims who chose to abandon Islam. Shortly after going public on February 28, 2007, the group received death threats by radical islamists.]

You see.. it matters not a scrap that "most Muslims" are moderate.. what really counts is where this kind of thing comes from..and we both know that...don't we?

Don't believe me, and surely not CJ Morgan or Pericles, and God forbid you believe Spikey..... but by all means believe the Muslims.

http://www.islam-qa.com/en/ref/12406

"The only overt Church discipline to be meeted out is to those who still claim to be Christians, but who are obviously living a double life and are involved in some act of on going sin.. such as an affair. In such cases, the welcome is removed."

From another recent thread http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?discussion=2077#43341
"1/ The applicant obtaining the divorce is not free to re-marry within her faith or community because in their eyes she is still legally married to the husband.

2/ The divorcing spouse would need to re-marry outside their faith and community, which could result in serious psychological consequences.

QUESTIONS/ISSUES. Should the law.. Australian law, make it unlawful for a religious group (this would apply to Christians equally) to use 'religious marriage' in this way? "

David, you need to make up your mind if faith communities are entitled to impose discipline on those who belong to that faith or not. On the one hand someone will be kicked out of church for living in sin, on the other you claim concern for the serious psychological consequences of someone forced outside their faith to continue a choice which goes against the teachings of that faith.

R0bert