Boaz, I don't understand why you would blame me for what other people have called you. I'm a teaser, not a name-caller. But, given that you asked, here goes:

To all those who've called Boaz_DAVID Bozo,loony, psychotic, paranoid, xenophobic,insane,armchair nazi etc: C'mon guys. I understand your frustration, and I'm not certainly questioning your accuracy, but does it really help your argument to bandy around these apt but frankly a-little-bit-rude monikers? Please people, play fair.

On other matters, look, I'd love state schools to be completely secular. My original point was simply that there's nothing to be scared of here. Suddenly people are talking about September 11 and concealed unlicenced weapons and swastikas and a "pressure cooker of seething resentment". It's lunacy. You're talking about kids, and you're talking about Sikhs. Has anyone ever met an aggressive Sikh? They're the people who come and help when some drunk white guy is hassling you in the street.

The world is a screwed up place, but this is one problem that I believe we can resolve peacably and sensibly. That's if the citizenry uses their collective common sense and eschews irrationality and thin-end-of-the-wedge thinking and fear-based, hysterical language.

By the way, I wrote to the Sikh Interfaith Council to express my distaste at the sensationalist way the Herald Sun had reported the incident. Here was their reply:

"We thank you very much for your support. You give us strength. Our religion teaches us to respect all religions. I am therefore thankful to your view and your insight [about the] sensationalism the press has been trying to create.

God bless you."

As I said earlier, run for the hills, people.

Bother,
I think you miss the point entirely, this is not a debate about wether or not sikh people are an aggresive culture or not.

Far from it, indeed at my school in Coffs Harbour I was fortunate to be friends with many sikh kids whos parents were banana farmers in the district, I can vouch that more awsome family orientated folk you would not find.

However that said, the debate about children being allowed to carry a dagger to school is about setting a precedent for all children to be armed with concealed weapons.

i.e If one group can carry a weapon or powerful religious symol then why not others.
Here is an interesting site about the Kirpan if your interested. http://www.sscnet.ucla.edu/southasia/Religions/paths/Kirpan.html

It is worn lest someone try to make the wearer do somthing against his religion.

You moonbats are always so quick to jump to the left you'd throw the baby out with the bath water.

CJ

It is good that you can see that allowing children to take knives to school is bad policy and an even worse precedent. The point is not whether the Sikhs are good people or not. A concealed weapon is a concealed weapon. Full stop. This is not to suggest that there are sikh kids out there just waiting to stab someone. I am sure that any danger from sikh students is very small.

The issue is that a good law which used to apply to everybody is now being abrogated because a very small part of the community wants special treatment. They have every right to expect special treatment because the Multiculturalists have been telling new migrants for years that you don’t have to change to fit in when you come to Australia.

I’m really tired of the stupid hijacking the debate by suggesting that those of us who are anti – multiculturalism are racists. For the hundredth time, I believe that we would get along far better as a mixed community if new migrants were made aware, and were prepared to accept, that some changes would be required if they wanted to live in Australia. If we let them know that where ‘Australian Values’ and their values clashed, theirs might have to give way we would have far less trouble.

In the end it all comes back to who is going to change in order to accommodate the other. Multiculturalism says that it should be us who changes so that others can retain their cultures and religions. Many of us feel that there needs to be more of an emphasis on migrants changing to fit in with us, rather than the other way around.

>> Culture isn't fixed
One wonders why the Aussie Sikhs and Muslims aren’t prepared to change on that basis. Maybe you could tell them that their cultures aren’t static. The very nature of the request that students take knives to school demonstrates that they view their religious and cultural requirements as being unyielding

Ozzie
Welcome back.
I will answer your question.
Umm I dont really think we need another culture.
Australia has its own culture Oz.
Its called The Aussie Culture.
Its part of why people came here and chose to live here.
Aussies are really ok people . They take heaps and just roll with the punches.
Some mistake their lay back attitude for laziness and lack of culture interests.
However Ozzie the truth is that is the culture- Lay back
Until others start to try to change our ways. Then you might be surprised.
Then the sleeping gaint awakes.
No Oz we love our country just like it is.
What do you think should happen.

Cheers Ozzie
pale

Paul.L, you seem to be developing the somewhat annoying habit of attributing arguments to me that I didn't actually put. I specifically argued that this issue isn't about multiculturalism, rather it's about the insidious reassertion of religionism that occurred under Howard's watch in Australia. And I certainly didn't mention race or racism.

Of course it's stupid policy to allow carrying concealed weapons into schools. But in this case it's not multiculturalism that's to blame - it's because religious beliefs have attained an unhealthy salience in education and other areas of governmental responsibilities during Howard's reign.

Sikhs, Muslims and immigrants of every religious affiliation eventually integrate into Australian society and culture. Invariably it's the immigrants who adjust more, but the host society and culture inevitably change as they accommodate fresh input.

With respect to Sikhs, there are good examples from northern NSW and north Queensland where generations of Sikhs have become well integrated into the local community but have still retained retained strong cultural and religious affiliations. I can't recall any appeals from them to allow their kids to wear concealed ceremonial daggers under their school uniforms. Maybe they always have but haven't told anyone about it?

Undoubtedly Muslims of various persuasions and ethnicities will do the same over a couple of generations. Such is the nature of Australian culture and society. But we need to remove religion once again from any salience outside its own purview. And that would involve its removal from State schools - starting with actively discouraging overt displays of religiosity like chaplains, hijabs, yarmulke, crosses etc.

I suspect that the Sikh kirpan wouldn't be much of an issue at all in such a climate.

Well... Scotty and Paul...even CJ (he is now officially back on the back porch mat..from the doghouse).. both see the real issue here.. and Botheration does not. (Bother..I don't worry about the names ... they make for a colorful exchange)

Its NOT about "Are Sikhs good people" or."Is the Sikh Religion dangerous" is only about ONE...thing "Australian law on concealed weapons".

It is total madness to allow foreign culture to overide Aussie law. If our laws are 'tweaked' and adjusted to suit the current cultural flavor of whoever is shouting loudest...then we are in deep trouble.

CJ.. I appreciate your eloquent expression of "One Nation, One Race, One Culture" in your comments :)

<<Sikhs, Muslims and immigrants of every religious affiliation eventually integrate into Australian society and culture. Invariably it's the immigrants who adjust more, but the host society and culture inevitably change as they accommodate fresh input.>>

Exxxxxxxxactly :) but mine takes less effort to say. Finally we are on the same page and in total agreement :