Oh phanto when you're good you're very good.

Houellebecq, I second that!

In addition, I should add, is that women (maybe it is only some women) do not want to take responsibility for the results of their own behaviour.

Firstly, if men do not try to initiate sex, it simply wont happen.

Secondly, the great paradox. (some) women both resent and desire male attention, some beleive that if a bloke doesn't try, she then believes or feels that he isn't attracted to her anymore.

Mostly I liked the article but a number of bit's leave a nagging concern

Like others I think that the authors have a differnet view of the state of Australia as it exists for most than I hold.

" We also need those men who oppose rape, and who actively negotiate their relationships with women on the basis of equality, respect and mutuality, to speak up and enter into these debates." - seems to imply that we are not already speaking up or entering into these debates and possibly makes a rather nasty suggestion about those who are already speaking up.

Like others I have concerns with the broadness of the unwanted sex category and complexity of the idea of "and often as a result of pressure from a sexual partner". What pressure is considered acceptable in relationship with an expectation that the parties are monogamous? I'd assume that physical intimidation is already covered by existing laws so pressure from sexual partners is something else, maybe a threat to end the relationship.

The author's closing comments left some scope for a broad discussion about sexual expectations within relationships. I don't think as a society we currently have a good framework to discuss some of the issues around this.

I'd like a clearer understanding of of what types of "pressure" from a partner the authors would consider legitimate. I think given the complexities of human nature there are a lot of times people do something because of the partners expectations which may not suit their own mood at the time. Often that may involve some pressure from the one who want's to do it (whatever the it is).

I don't think the whole issue is nearly as simple as some would like to make it, the discourse is all to often built around a piecemeal historical context and often with what appears to be an underlying assumeption that "mens" sexual wants are somewhat less valid than "womens" (with an acknowledgement that sometimes the stereotypes go the other way).

R0bert

I think women throughout time have had unwanted sex. I find it better to embrace masturbation. Men may just be as happy to self satisfy but a bit hard without rocking the bed and alerting the other half. If it was consider healthy and normal to accept masturbation then women would not have to lie back and think of England just to get him from pestering for it. Seems a taboo subject in many marriages though, should be ok to say "can I have the bedroom for half an hour on my own" then everyone happier. Afterall usually they do want it more, let them have their fun without guilt.

equitable power is achieved with law enacted by agreement between a women's legislature
and a men's legislature evidenced in absentia with the observation that legislation has "had
absolutely no effect whatsoever in reducing violence against women over the past quarter
century, in public or private".
http://2mf.net/inexpertise.htm

"what young women endure in their everyday lives would for men be considered prison conditions".
http://2mf.net/news158.htm

women suffer while men feign expertise.

.H
You prove your point you really are generation X ,
Where X = Don't understand (others sensitivities) but are willing to slag it off anyway.
Don't know anything. But willing to display it.
Don't stand for anything, but willing to attack those who do.
Don't see further than your own self interest.
Don't have any empathy and proud of it.
don't want anybody to be any more than you.
and therefore you limit yourself to you and your opinion(sic) don't matter.
It's good the authors are the antithesis of you.

and crew
Oh ye of little depth and even shorter sight.

Ladies.
Fortunately very unattractive yobs (extremes) doesn't define the gender. Consider the Bell curve distribution.

My mum used to say "a man chases a woman until she catches him".
I made a lot of drinks by matching up guys with woman by simply watching, body language, glances etc. Ok, I hid my technique with BS about Astrology.

I find it sad to note how many of the younger generation have lost that skill of observation replaced by self fulfilling cynicism.

I blame our impersonal communication both technological mobiles, texting, face(less) book and a ME culture.

A wise man (gay) once told me that "if you want to catch a fish appeal to the fish (girl) not your mates...(the rest is unrepeatable here)

With that I changed my dress sense, toned my larrikinism down, drank in lounge bars etc not clubs and front bars. Surprise, surprise I started to notice 'those' looks coming to me, and from a better type of woman despite my average looks.

The point is (girls too): Psychological fact, first impressions are made in the first 20 seconds and are hard to shake (whether you see them looking or not).

So, dress to what you want to attract and behave accordingly. It might be fashionable but what does it says about you? And look for key clues.
Nothing new there, every good rep is taught a business application of that.
How do you think your grannies found their love at first sight, soul mates