I'm one who had not gone back and read the original speach. I'd not considered the possibility that the article would significantly misrepresent the content of the speach.

After a read of the original I have to agree that there is nothing obvious in relation to homosexuals. If anything "That which is often expressed and understood by the term "gender," results finally in the self-emancipation of man from creation and from the Creator." had me wondering about a number of possibilities.

My original point that someone who heads up and endorses a forced celebacy has no moral high ground to use to proclaim the sacredness of male/female sexuality or for that matter the divine nature of marriage remains. "The great Scholastic theologians have characterised matrimony, the life-long bond between man and woman, as a sacrament of creation, instituted by the Creator himself and which Christ - without modifying the message of creation - has incorporated into the history of his covenant with mankind"

A strange irony that those who have rejected in their own lives what they consider god ordained can be so determined in their defense of that.

R0bert

trav, the beating up of the catholic church is becoming (somewhat) a more regular occurrence. i just wouldn't agree that it's normally a beat-up.

Perhaps the Pope and his followers should give up wearing their gay drag attire, it always surprises me that they know there is a so called God, how do they know? there is no proof, he should look at all of his gay mates and associates in the Catholic church before he makes stupid statements.

I am also positive that if his beloved Jesus was here now, he wouldn't have his own jet at his disposal, live in luxury, how people can believe the rubbish that comes out of this man's mouth astounds me.
Look after the poor, the Pope wouldn't know where to start or what to do.

This very same issue was raised in the General section on 29-12-08 and debate died when the speech was linked.

An in house speech mainly about the World Youth Day and a bit taken out of context by a journo. An attempted beat up by the media.

Whether the Pope actually criticised homosexuality in this speech or not, his actions speak louder than words.

The Vatican actively resists the decriminalisation of homosexuality in countries where homosexuals are discriminated against, bashed, tortured, and even killed just because of their sexual orientation. This violates human rights.

I don’t understand why the Catholic Church, as a human rights violator with its anti-homosexuality stance, still has any right of speech in the UN General meetings.
Religion should have no place in politics.

It seems that the Pope is as confused about homosexual behaviour as are those who practice such behaviour. Homosexual behaviour is not about sex and never has been. Rape is not about sex, nor is pedophilia, nor is prostitution, nor is sado-masochism or celibacy or many other sexual aberrations. Many people ‘act out’ their emotional needs by using sexual behaviour. Just because someone indulges in homosexual behaviour it does not automatically follow that it is natural and a perfectly rational reaction to an attraction to another human being. People do not always behave rationally. When they don’t they often become very good at rationalising their behaviour. The alcoholic who tells everyone he is just ‘socialising’, the compulsive gambler who thinks it is ok to steal from his boss are just not facing up to their underlying problem.

Rationalising can become very clever and can be very convincing. Groups of people with the same problem can get together and make a big loud noise almost enough to frighten and bully others into believing their rationalizations. They can even lobby and intimidate politicians into creating laws which claim that their rationalizations are really just a question of ‘equal rights’.

When we discuss homosexual behaviour as if it is an ‘orientation’ or that it is in accordance with human nature we have fallen for the trap and have become ‘co-dependent’. No one’s behaviour is above criticism and blindly accepting someone’s self explanation for their own behaviour is a foolish thing to do.