Polycarp, I'd like you to do something.

Firstly, drop the patronising act. When you make statements like "lessons for Nursul" you are trying to position yourself as a teacher. It comes across as very patronising to people who think you're so invested in scripture that you can't operate within any kind of framework without it.

In fact, I don't think I've really seen any discussions on OLO where you can reason for yourself without resorting to either the bible or the qu'ran.

Now - here's something you should try, just for one week:

Forget all of that scriptural voodoo.

All of it.

Just, dump it. Or at least, realise that sensible people, today, don't give a damn.

I know you make the point that "THEY care, so WE should care."

Actually, 'they' believe many different things. Each is a different person. Many of them make use of that scriptural pap to control others, which is a damn shame.

Many don't.

So, how is this for an idea - for one week, try to live without thinking of the bible, or the qu'ran. Try to use the mind you have been giften with.

Just, for a week or so, see if your moral compass can function without resorting to the instruction manual you've chosen to support yours, (or the instruction manual you use to attack others).

Examinator,
I think you might have missed Trav's point. People here keep thinking it is ok to be fearful of Christian fruitcakes, but the same people here call others "Islamophobic" for fearing Islamic fruitcakes. The author's and other contributors here keep insisting that calling people Islamophobic is somehow going to help the situation. The term "Islamophobia" is just as inaccurate as "Christophobia". Both have been wordsmithed to end discussion.

I have friends who live in Indonesia. Some of them call themselves muslims, but inside they hate Islam. They have discovered for themselves the insanity that Islam perpetuates. But for fear of ostricism ond retribution, they keep calling themselves muslim. So according to the author and many other contributors here, these Indonesian friends of mine are Islamophobic. Gee that's a big help.

"Criticism and free speach are very important and should be encouraged for social progress" says the auther in one spot, and

"Furthermore Islam is compatible with democracy and human rights like any other religion" in another.

Then how would the author reconcile her two statements, with this:

http://www.melaniephillips.com/articles-new/?p=635&print=1

Nursel, you stereotype Christianity while condemning stereotyping of Muslims.

For perhaps the majority of Christians and Muslims their religion is a merely a cultural identity. In Australia no one begrudges a person who wishes to draw spiritual nourishment from Islamic tradition.

What is of public concern are Muslim doctrines, ie the content of the religion – particularly concerning establishment of religion, jihad, and status of non-Muslims in Muslim States. A cursory look at current Islamic countries will show you this is a real problem, and a problem for immigrant Muslim communities also, for example in Victoria.

http://www.saltshakers.org.au/pdf/313278_VCAT_-_DOCUMENTS_RELATIN.pdf

Attempting to whitewash these genuine issues with charges of racism is mindless really. There are many different races who profess to be Muslim. It doesn’t make sense. I don’t think you have cared to take religion seriously and considered the distinctiveness of Islam.

There are scholars who are working hard on Islamic theology trying to adapt it to modern civil society but their cause is not helped when honest criticism is confused with racism. It means that Muslims themselves who wish to speak out receive no public support from non Muslims who have been silenced by politically correct speech codes.

You do violence to immigrant Muslim communities Nursel.

The shallowness of your religious knowledge shows with your parroting of popular prejudices against Christianity that with a little will and a half an hour of research could dispel; and you want us to take seriously your understanding of the nature of the problems of Islam and public life?

If you really want to contribute to a justly ordered community and want to, in charity, inform the ignorant, you simply have to do some work. If you want to talk about religion there is no substitute for honest inquiry. Please read from a variety of sources.

Dont' be afraid.

Godbless.

Oh one more thing - it is obscene to attempt to equate morally the deliberate murder of civilians (New York, Bali, Madrid, London, Mumbai, Beslan, Africa) and the accidental death of civilians while targeting armed combatants (who often use civilians as a shield).

The article makes a good point about extremism in both religions being oppressive.

"anti-essentialism; cultural relativism; tolerance of difference; freedom of speech; secularism; separation of state and religion; sexual permissiveness; human rights; women’s rights; homosexual rights; minority rights."

These are all freedoms the rest of us would lose if fundamentalists from either side had their way. Plenty of Islam-free discussions on these issues at this site have seen upper case Christians in condemnation mode. Both sides see Western society as inherently evil.

Between fundamentalists of both sides it boils down to which side gets to oppress the rest of us. One does it by stealth, infiltrating our systems and institutions, the other by blowing people up.

Different tactics and strategy, but with the same goal of sending us back to the dark ages.