HRS writes: "I think you should first gain some practice in searching for information yourself, and then you can ask me for further information, and I will gladly supply it."

Please quit being nasty. Clearly the onus is on you to support your claims, not on those who disagree with you. If you can't provide evidence, I can only assume your claims are invented. Anyway, surely it's better to be honest, rational, and use evidence to argue your point, rather than putting others down?

While you're providing this evidence, perhaps you could also tell us who argues that "condoms are not much more effective than using nothing at all". As you may know, abstinence-only sex education programs in the US have given misleading information about the effectiveness of condoms. Some peddle downright lies — one abstinence only course suggested that HIV can pass through condoms because latex is porous. The Government Accountability Office conducted an audit into inaccurate material — you can see that report here: http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d0787.pdf

Also, two independent reports to the US Congress recently found that "abstinence-only programs have no effect on teenage sexual activity and do not meet a basic scientific standard".

See: http://washingtonindependent.com/view/assessing-abstinence

I can direct you to reports about research into abstinence-only education. Studies in the US show that: "the upshot [of abstinence-only sex education is] that while teenagers in the U.S. have about as much sexual activity as teenagers in Canada or Europe, Americans girls are four times as likely as German girls to become pregnant, almost five times as likely as French girls to have a baby, and more than seven times as likely as Dutch girls to have an abortion. Young Americans are five times as likely to have H.I.V. as young Germans, and teenagers' gonorrhea rate is 70 times higher in the U.S. than in the Netherlands or France."

Please see: http://www.nytimes.com/2005/02/16/opinion/16kristof.html?_r=1&th=&oref=slogin&pagewanted=print&position=

HRS,

You are fighting a rear guard action here.

Promoting abstinence as an alternative to contraception is ludicrous. Nearly all of humanity's existence is tied up with sex in one way or another.

The "good old days" involved restricting a woman's rights so severely that she could do nothing without the permission of a permanent man.

No woman wants to have an abortion, but sometimes it is the last option between freedom and servitude to the dictates of her biology.

Anyone who suggests turning the clock back to the Victorian era is either seriously naive or deliberately deluding themselves in the way the creationists convince themselves that science is wrong.

If your beliefs are based on religion, then there is no serious discussion here only the mutterings of doctrine.

Robert,
You are arguing with government regulations. The recommended list of risk control measures is written into nearly all government safety regulations. The government rates personal protective equipment (eg condoms) and administrative procedures (eg sex education classes) as the least reliable ways to reduce a risk.

Veronika,
It is pleasing that you are now looking for information yourself. If you want information concerning teenage-pregnancy and fathers, try searching “The association between father absence and early teenage sexual activity and pregnancy has long been noted” and then search for more information regarding that.

Sex education classes are not reliable.

eg
“Doctors who developed a sex education programme for schools throughout Britain have concluded it is no better at preventing unwanted pregnancies than traditional approaches.”
http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2006/nov/21/health.sexeducation

This failed course was called Share, for "sexual health and relationships: safe, happy and responsible".

As you possibly know, the age for sexual activity is decreasing in many countries (and going below the age of consent I might add), while the reliability of condoms generally decreases with the age of the user. It becomes totally improbable to somehow get children of a younger and younger age to effectively use a condom, or any other form of contraception. Most children won’t even eat properly unless forced to.

Even when used correctly, a condom is not effective against all STD’s.

eg
[The condom] is not very effective at all against diseases like the Herpes Simplex Virus strains 1 and 2, HPV the cause of Genital Warts and Cervical Cancer, Genital Crabs or Pubic Lice, as well as Body Lice other wise known as Scabies.
http://yourstdhelp.com/condoms_and_stds.html

Interesting how I could not find such information on a number of abortion company web sites, even though they encourage the use of condoms. I think this shows the ethics and reliability of abortion clinics.

Fractell,
“Why would anyone want to continually have abortions?” I have no idea, but find one feminist organization that does not support the removal of abortion laws. Next feminists will want to remove all traffic laws, and replace them with driving classes, seat belts and more hospitals.

HRS, in a former career I worked in an ocupation which required me to do potentially very hazardous tasks. We could not always remove the hazard, replace it with a lesser hazard or engineer it away so we trained regularly and wore PPE. That's life in some cases.

I had driver training when I was younger and wear a seat belt (PPE) when I drive my car, by the logic you are using the government should be focussing on stopping me driving rather than ensuring that I wear a seat belt and drive within the road rules.

When I ride a pushbike I wear a helmet, again by your logic the trick would be to just tell me not to ride a pushbike ever and all will be well.

R0bert

HRS,

The link to The Guardian article you posted was about how the Share sex education program was no more effective than traditional sex education classes. Nowhere did it say “sex education classes are not reliable” — it's point was that a new sex education program that should have been more effective than the old method turned out not to be.

You wrote: “[The condom] is not very effective at all against diseases like the Herpes Simplex Virus strains 1 and 2, HPV the cause of Genital Warts and Cervical Cancer, Genital Crabs or Pubic Lice, as well as Body Lice other wise known as Scabies.”
Because these disease spread via skin rather than sexual contact. Herpes in particular is a major worry. This is EXACTLY why kids need sex education — to learn how different diseases are transmitted, and to protect themselves.

As the website you link to points out, condoms are very effective at preventing pregnancy and sexually transmitted diseases like HIV. It's the best we've got. And as you said earlier, we should also be working toward finding better methods of contraception.

I note that you didn't provide proof for the questions I asked. To be honest, I’m pretty sure you don’t have any.

Robert,
Exactly. To carry out a hazardous task while relying on PPE and training to significantly reduce the hazards means that you have to be highly trained, the training has to be continuous, and the PPE has to be in perfect working order. Unfortunately such training is normally very expensive and time consuming, and PPE is not often in perfect working order.

That is why the better companies stop focusing on PPE and training to reduce hazards, and try for something better. It is either that or go out of business.

"Saying that the use of condoms is ‘safe sex’ is in fact playing Russian roulette. A lot of people will die in this dangerous game." Dr. Teresa Crenshaw, member of the U.S. Presidential AIDS Commission and past president of the American Association of Sex Educators.

Applying risk management principles to abortions and STD’s, you have to minimize the amount the amount of sex, significantly decrease the number of partners, and be using something more reliable than a condom. It is either that or be dead, and people spend a long time dead.

Feminists have tried to get around all this by saying that the fetus is not human. Next feminists will be trying to brainwash people into believing that anyone who dies of an STD was not human.

Veronika,
If you have so many questions, I think it doesn’t say much for the reliability of your sex education. Keep searching, but in the meantime, don’t rely on the condom.