csteele

'There is virtually no mention of hell or eternal damnation or even an afterlife in the Old Testament.'

I have no delight in informing you that you are wrong on this issue. Daniel foretold of hell. 'And many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.' (Daniel 12:2)

Few Jews also believed Jesus was their Messiah. When He returns the Jewish nation will turn and believe. Hopefully a few more people will also lose the scales off their eyes and be able to see that Jesus died for their sins also. Without His mercy and grace we are totally lost and continue to be wise only in our own eyes as seen by many of the posters on OLO.

How we all got here is due to comets & asteroids & the like. Just watch The History Channel (among others). Namely, The Universe series. None of this "The Bible/Koran/whatever says..." nonsense. Of course, "Gullibles 'R Us" will luv to treasure the illogical. The more the better in their eyes. ;) -LOL. Many sarcastic comics are religious & political at the same time. Do the math.

when one faces death or at least faces real hardship like starvation, one gets a differing view of a god. On the other hand when one is living it up in wealth & doesn't know any better/the difference, then one can easily tag them selves as in the "Gullible 'R Us" club. ;) -LOL.Btw, my grandad was a pow in WW2. I nearly had a brain tumor twice. 2 brain surgeries.

Sticky... your last post was interesting. "But none of this is evidence for a Creator"

WHICH....of course is why, most evangelists point to the resurrection of Christ as the ultimate evidence. The Acts of the Apostles (The book in the Bible) is really the story of the proclamation of the "Resurrected Jesus"..it has also been called 'the Acts of the Holy Spirit'.

All we can do, is point to this central and determinative historical event, and interpret it to you as per the Scriptures.

Paul describes it like this:

<<"For what I received I passed on to you as of first importance- that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4that he was buried,>>

COMMENT. To this point, we have the description of some historical facts. But how strong are they ? I don't know of anyone who disagrees thus far with the history side of things (except Muslims who have a vested theological interest in denying Christs death)

<<that he was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures,>>

COMMENT. Now..here it suddenly becomes awry and spooky......HUH? what's this 'he was raised' ? Lets read on..

<<and that he appeared to Peter,
and then to the Twelve.

After that, he appeared to more than five hundred of the brothers at the same time, most of whom are still living, though some have fallen asleep.

7Then he appeared to James,

then to all the apostles, and last of all

he appeared to me also....>>

COMMENT Note those words "Most of whom are still living"

Perhaps you respond with "Do you seek to make me a Christian in such a short time" ?

and to which I respond..

9Paul replied, "Short time or long—I pray God that not only you but all who are listening to me today may become what I am, except for these chains."

Acts 26... makes interesting reading Sticky.

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=51&chapter=26&version=31

One never knows... one's presuppositions might shift :)
-blessings.

Ha ha George, that is a lovely poem.

There are many things beyond my ken I am sure. :)

The world is a beautiful place and there is much joy even in realism. In understanding that we are just one element interacting in our environment. What is more magnificent than looking out over a beautiful sky or a mountain with forests and streams abounding. Or the simple joy in looking at a flower, a bird or a small child with curiosity and wonderment in their eyes. There is richness all around us if we take the time to stop and smell the roses (so to speak).

I was raised as an atheist by two ex-Catholic parents so have never known what it is like to believe in a God of any form (God, Buddha, Mohammed). My mother still had us Christened while she was struggling with her own strong Catholic (Nun schooled) upbringing. We were simply bought up to respect others and our environment, show compassion and treat others as we would wish to be treated (no different from some of the religious teachings).

There is that old saying that there are no atheists in war. That is probably true and I guess that is the point, when people are desperate they grasp onto anything that may provide strength, solace or peace (or meaning). This does not mean that God exists but than man has created something that he believes he needs.

If man needs this...well that is a whole other argument, but for many they are content with the natural state of things.

Yes George, a clever ditty indeed. I cheerfully admit that there's plenty beyond my ken too - which is of course a good reason to continue learning and questioning. What annoys me most about religionists is their collective smug delusion that their "ken" is the right one.

To me, heaven is where I was on Sunday evening - surrounded by almost pristine nature by the side of a mountain stream, with a fishing rod and a few beers and listening to the cricket on the radio. Hell is where I am now, having come down with a god-awful head cold for my sins.

But I'm just a simple man really. Bugger the afterlife, live this one to the full!