Evolve your attitude towards all God's creatures. The RIGHT answer will not reveal itself to you until you do so!

I myself am not far off the age of 60 and by gee i have spent more years than i care to remember on and around the land.

You are quite happy to glean information from wherever it suits you lady and it all conveniently falls 'your way" and thats part of the huge problem of all Al`s..its "your way " or nothing,when are you going to listen that it dosent work..

Try and spend your energies on something far more important to the world as in feeding the poor or addressing the polluting countries...oh you do drive a car dont you? So you too are a polluter?
Or do you use a polluting tram/train/ or bus/? electric public transport vehicles use brown coal burns to provide the power you know hmm more pollution for one so dedicated to making the world "right" .

Use electricity at home? Of course you do,hell a girls gotta have a hairdryer eh? Blondes luv their own hair.

Does your boss know that you are using his time,computer,power etc to address your silly ideas on a public forum? Hmm thats cheating you know!

Thats rather rude of you Heather, assuming no one on this thread nows what they are talking about. Yes, get some yank doing the hard sell on himself to boost his own book, video, whatever, sales to tell us all how to do it. Sounds like hes farming gullible humans now instead. Bet you've bought havent you Heather?

Get out there and get some experience of what farming in THIS country is all about then you may have some credibility. You dont learn that stuff in books or on websites.

Strewth

I thought this thread was on cruelty to animals.

All we have here from cowboy clowns, who clearly lack a basic ability to comprehend the subject matter on "Taking a stand for all animals" are inane bleatings, now degenerated to matters on:

"blondes, pollution, hairdryers, tofu, buses, trams, trains, Linda Stoner, brown coal etc etc".

Where's the relevance to the subject?

This poster clearly requires treatment for his mental disorders.

Farmers and dippers exposed to organophosphate pesticides can develop chronic peripheral neuropath and neurophysical abnormalities.

Now those symptons couldn't be evident than on this thread.

And that's just one of the dangerous practices these "evolved" and "knowledgeable" farmers perpetrates on himself, his animals, other humans and the environment.

So who are the "ignoramuses" freerangemeat/gryphon?

Strewth

I thought this thread was on cruelty to animals.

All we have here from cowboy clowns, clearly who lack the ability to comprehend the subject matter on "Taking a stand for all animals" since bleatings have now degenerated to matters on:

"blondes, pollution, hairdryers, tofu, buses, trams, trains, Linda Stoner, brown coal etc etc".

Where's the relevance to the subject?

This poster clearly requires treatment for his mental disorders.

Farmers and dippers exposed to organophosphate pesticides can develop chronic peripheral neuropath and neurophysical abnormalities.

Now those symptons couldn't be evident than on this thread.

And that's just one of the dangerous practices these "evolved" and "knowledgeable" farmers perpetrates on himself, his animals, other humans and the environment.

So who are the "ignoramuses" freerangemeat/gryphon?

PF,
No, not rudeness, but irritation at the rudeness of constant references, by the pro-'meat' community here, to my, & likeminded other's, assumed lack of knowledge/logic!

It is CONSTANTLY touted as a valid argument; to say, what amounts to, "Your not living like us makes your opinion worth nothing!" Constant attempts at highjacking The Debate, so as to reconstruct it as A Right to Ridicule &/or Dismiss, is what is rude!

So given the constant pseudo-argument; "your side of the debate is wrong because YOU ..." it WAS reasonable of me to quote someone who HAS had 40+ years success in the farming sector AND who DID evolve into believing that 'meat alternatives' ARE the future of farming!

We live in a global community, nowadays, not just an Australian one, so there should be some credit given to the opinion of a long-term farmer, EVEN from another country!

Climate Change & Health Concerns are just two among the several globally relevant issues, let alone other issues, which are driving the push to farm differently, everywhere in the world!

So I think 'the problem', with my opinions, for the pro-'meaters', ISN'T that I'm a (presumed blonde, employed, hairdrier-user, etc etc) City Slicker NOR that Howard Lyman is an Amercian (& for that reason alone presumed, apparently, to know nothing relevant to GLOBAL ISSUES which ARE relevant to farming everywhere - even Australia!)

No, the pro-'meaters' just find it easier to attack the validity of The Other Side of The Debate's entitlement to contribute to a reasonable debate! My putting forward the opinion of someone else, of much farming experience, was a logical response, I thought, given that MY opinion was repeatedly classed as 'dismissable'! I'm called the rude one!? I'm glad the direction of my evolving is not the same as those who are trying to evolve The Awareness of Basic Cruelty 101 beyond the limits it has already been stretched to. That's WHY I jumped ahead to a point in the debate that is about 'farming alternatives' .. when some are still way back there on 'defn's of cruelty'!

“We live in a global community, nowadays, not just an Australian one, so there should be some credit given to the opinion of a long-term farmer, EVEN from another country!”

Heather, the discussion at the time was about sheep and I believe the question was being asked, what do we do with the wethers and broken mouthed ewes if they don’t go on the ships. I don’t know if you realize it or not, but the US are not big on sheep farming so I think, in this instance, that your ‘long term farmer’ would have little to contribute. Why is it necessary to consult someone overseas any way? They are not living with these issues. What point is there to protesting about these problems if you have no solutions yourself. No, vegan is not the answer. There are people that can survive a veggie diet, but if you took a look at the bigger picture, there are those that could not, they need to eat meat. I believe we were designed that way , sorry.

Your argument "your side of the debate is wrong because YOU ..." ….. guilty of that very thing yourself I feel. I doubt that you would be happy with any other result than a world of vegans.

I believe cropping and chemical farming has caused far greater environmental problems than farming animals ever could. That would only increase under vegan rule.