Thank you, Wendy, for your many valuable posts on this issue.

I've printed out some stickers and passed a few around.

I'll write to Vaile and Downer, and think some more about some of your other suggestions.

Ha, looking forward to reading the Queen's letter!

I've just received an email from the social party (Dutch one) that they're lobbying to place (hidden) camera's at animal markets and in fact, any places that deal in animals to catch more offenders. It's very likely to go through.

They've been routinely anonymously checking animal markets for cruelty and found some offenders- now there will be a ban for the offenders by law to deal in animals again- much like losing your driver's licence.

Wendy, do you know if that's going to be introduced here as well?

Letter from The Queen
http://www.livexports.com/queen.html

Dr Wirth Press conference.>

We've got political grandstanding particularly in the States and lack of accountability. Pockets of community indifference and therefore complacency. Differences in philosophy, extreme and differences in conduct of advocacy groups.

Animal welfare was never part of the Christian Judaic tradition.was the humanist revolution that occurred in the United Kingdom at the end of the Eighteenth Century/early Nineteenth Century.
The leader in that group of course was William Wilberforce. He was appalled that human slavery still existed in the British Empire and was justified on the basis of the Bible.

He took on the might of the British Empire and won. How he did this is a matter of history but having said this and having abolished slavery and brought about some measure of control about cruelty to children, it was a simple and logical thing to move to animals.

Animals are simply property and under the law and under cultural tradition.

The great Eastern religions preached the value of the kinship of humans and animals and they still do today.


Frances of Assisi attempted to do something about this when he was alive and he probably did more than any other person in the Christian denomination to try and get some semblance of religious basis for our relationship.

Long Speech. Is long overdue that churches Took The Stand Against Animal cruelty .

After two years Of Writing to Senator Steve Fielding along with A Visit and two thousand letters to Churches Australia Wide.

We wait For A single reply!

Please Write To Your church and Ask them to Speak Out for Gods creatures and Ban livde exports and Intensive Farming.

WE will Contiune to Ask Family first Along With Ministers and ALL Churches to listen to the 96 percent of Australian People.

Any human being with the slightest deceny would not hesitate to act.
live Exports is A gross injustice carried out by a few greedy men who have no concern for animal welfare or jobs for their fellow Australians.
SHAME

Excellent post, Wendy! I'm glad you got your link to work.

I hope I won't have a nightmare after looking at Downer's face, hehe.

Actually, it might be a good idea to start a discussion on what churches could do right here and now, and what the reason might be for ignoring the issue.
I hope that there are some religious people on here wanting to take part in this discussion.
Always good to look at a problem from all angles.

Wendy, if that doesn't work and this discussion flops, then we could indeed try to start our own under 'general' I believe, still have to find out about how to use this new tag.

Hey Wendy & Celivia

Great point about respect for animals NOT being a part of the judeo-christian tradition. Note how few, if any, christian posters (especially the anti-choicers) get involved in the animal welfare threads.

Wendy, I don't know if this is of any use to you, but I shop at Belgrave Meats, Victoria. They specialise in free range, non-chemical produce. Their phone number is 03 9754 2371. While I know they are committed to organic farming principles I am not sure how far this commitment goes with regard to humane treatment of animals - although it seems that free-range farming methods tend to go with more humane practice. Anway, I thought it might be a good idea to collect details of all butchers who offer alternatives to mass produced/intensive farming. We could collect info on the 'general' blog, perhaps.

I try to do my share regards volunteer work at animal shelters and selective buying. Wish I could become vegetarian, anyway, no one is perfect.

Cheers

Scout.Celivia

Your ideas show you both as leaders. Scout dont wish you were a vegatarian please.

Its better aproaching the every day person being one of them.

Thanks for the number and your volunteer work.

Celivia Yes there are many people in countries working, lets not warn the enermy.
Scout If you wouldnt mind could I to chat to you heres the web page>
www.livexports.com

Might be helful to tell people how the Government get away with this cruelty of live exports.

AVA> Australian Vetinary Association.

A secret soceity nominating a new President each year.

Despite! the last 60 minutes report they have NOT put live exports back on the board room table?

For this to happen at least two of their members.

You would Think ! two vets would stand by the animals they swore their allegiance to despite! the consequences.


Young ones are elected as Presidents and I think its clear as to why.

Target the AVA The Churches and of course the Ministers of Trade.

The AVA were both amazed and nervous when I told them we would rally outside.

What I dont get is why.

Its not Rocket sceience that THEIR to blame.

I also dont get why the other groups such as Animal Liberation etc have not thought to do that.

Surely its better to the education of the public. Teach them who is responsibly for approving live exports and intensive farming

Dont forget each State Premier is also Minister of trade for his State so write.

They will tell you its all the Federal Goverments doing.[of course]

We need farmers working together with live importers.

Thats not hard to do because MANY overseas people would be very interested.


Stand outside Elders Real Estates with a group and protest.

Elders are the largest live exporters of Animals in Australia.

Please click Here and send this to everybody you write.

http://consciousevolution.com/onshu/view_signatures.php

And Please! Ask everybody to click here and add your name and comments
http://consciousevolution.com/onshu/Petition.php


To stop Live Exports we MUST offer the farmers and Goverment an alternative. Help Us find that for tbe animals sake.[please]

Wendy dear, I know that you have an emotional obsession with
live exports, but I was about to say, trying to force Govts to
ban live exports is about as useful as trying to force Govts
to ban toilets. ie, its totally pointless unless and until
better options are put in place and exist, which right now
they don't.

If live exports of sheep were banned tomorrow from West Australia,
there would be untold suffering of the very animals that you
claim to care about.

The days are long past where Govts operate meatworks and similar
private enterprise institutions. So pleading to Govts to do
so, will fall on deaf ears.

Anyone is free to put their money where their mouth is, build
another meatworks and slaughter sheep locally, that were destined
for the live trade. Cost of local slaughter is far lower then
live tranport. If people want credibility, they are free to make
it happen, rather then chant away like the Hare Krishnas :)

Meantime, in the case of the live sheep trade from WA, we have to
judge it by what is happening now. Boats have lifted their standards, regulations have changed, old boats are being ditched,
the industry is changing. Fact is, as Cameron Morse from the
Countryman showed, today's live sheep trade is not much different
to any feedlot in Australia, except that it floats.

Despite these many positive changes, if people still get their
breasts in a tangle over this issue, they are free to create
alternatives for farmers and make them happen. Banning live
exports would be like banning toilets. The smell might go away
but the problems created would be far worse then the suggested
cure.

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