Irfan

I sincerely hope that at least one of the islam-ists have the courage to take you up on your generous offer.

I await the outcome.

Mr Jelata,

Thank you for your honesty in replying to our questioning.

It is a bit rich to put all ‘barbaric’ history under the one banner of “Christendom”and non und "Islamism".

1. My questions to you were about the content of the Qur’an – but you don’t want to go there because you say you are not a scholar of Islam.

>>I love to seeing and experiencing rather than details of Quran.<<

But you are a Moslem aren’t you? That means you recite parts of the Qur’an daily – don’t you?

Unless you are a non-practicing Moslem you should at least understand what you are telling Allah and what you are reading, don’t you think?

No need to be a scholar for that – there is no real magic in the (Arabic) words.

But I think your attitude of total “surrender” is causing you not to think for yourself but just follow (like cheep). That is the attitude of the millions of Muslims around the globe. They are angry at the West because their leaders tell them they have to be.

You summed it all very well and I quote you:

“Indeed most muslims are pacifist yet ready with any possible meaning of Jihad.”

So do you understand why we cannot embrace multiculturalism with such people?

2. You also say: >>I'm like you who believe imposing concept of peace into religions is more likely to be successful than erasing the religions… I dont know exactly the way but I'm optimistic.<<

It’s not up to you or your optimism – you should know by now that the Qur’an is unchangeable – unfortunately it is too late for:

>>Allah is in mood in "erasing" such verse. He is all - mercyful..<<

What is written is written – it is now up to the "good” Moslems to follow the commands of Allah “verbatim” or burn in hell.

So if you are really a pacifist, it’s time you put on your logic glasses and your thinking hat and use your common sense. (Instead of following an intrinsically brutal religion)

Mr Coach ofcourse I'm reading Quran everyday in my prayers. I'm also think about it but spirituality is somewhat beyond our thought you as a devout Christian must understand this.

I'm understanding Quran in a style of science called "Hikma", a bit sufistic tradition, those, verses are only way to a kind of religious insight, not a scientific stuff. And the whole existence is actually His verses - Quran are a part of the whole. I'm also using phenomenologic and dialectic style of thought in these matters.

Verses history are well recorded and I must understand the 'deeper messages', not literal messages.

We differ in understanding God. Because your god is Roman and platonic and 'our God' are eastern and He often confuse you. Our prophet was a figure bound to his own time, rules and moralities, and our understanding to verses are flexible and based on Islamic concept of ijtihad.

Such as, there are no verses or sunna about nuclear weapon but many muslims (I have not survey all) agree we must not develop such weapon because it oppose the constructive message of Islam.

I think we agree that war sometimes is inevitable but it is necessary to control our attitude during wall and not 'seeking' for it. Nor we must attack our peaceful Christian neighbours and countries. And we must put war at last, very last options. Even Taoism will agree this.
Remember, you see in History, we practiced it.

So western campaign against Midle East is only another unchristianity they repeat and repeat again. I am and many muslims will go jihad when this attack have reach to certain degree we could not bear. What's the problem? We are responsible to defend Jesus messages too.

But I dont see now is to late for peace initiative. Our jihad is including fighting our impatience.

Irf – I don’t need to get out more. I live in Sydney’s east, I know plenty of Muslims. Did you think I had never met one? Amazingly, I even have a friend who is Muslim – I must hide my ‘hate for all Muslims’ very well, since she has never noticed that I ‘hate’ her. I have also worked with Muslims and as you know very well (because I have said so many times), I have no complaint against any Muslim who lives peacefully in Australia, obeys the law and refrains from trying to force Islamic customs onto the rest of us. The Muslims who don’t do these things are the ones who bother me - like the Lebenese gang who knifed and almost killed my son because he refused to hand over his money and phone.

‘Generalised allegations’? Such as? All my ‘allegations’ have involved things happening right now – trials of Muslims arrested for terrorism, the riots in France, and the high level of Muslim violence in Australia. Hardly 'generalised allegations'.

Thank you for the kind invitation but so far you have not responded to one question I asked. Does this mean that you yourself can find no positives in Islam? Or that you do not know why such large numbers of Muslims refuse to integrate into Western society?

The accusation of hating *all* Muslims/blacks/Asians/whoever is an old ploy designed to silence critics and to avoid answering awkward questions. You keep accusing me, all I can do is to keep saying, ‘No, I do not hate all Muslims’. It is absolutely absurd to accuse critics of Islam of hating *all* Muslims – I’m simply not stupid enough to hate millions of people I have never met - for any reason.

My questions concerning Islam are quite reasonable - strange that no Muslim wants to answer them.

G'day Irf

I won't take up your offer of touring mosques. As I've said, I've worked with mossies in 4 different countries. I've seen enough. Also, after 'insulting' mossies by telling them to please abide by the law and receiving the usual death threats I don't want to show my face around any mosque unless I'm afforded the same level of protection that Geert Wilders and Ayaan HirsiI Ali 'enjoy'.

Tell you what, if I go to a mosque will you visit the national parks and centrelink and tell your co-religionists to abide by the law, by a ticket and stop the welfare rorts. All other apologists are welcome to do same, in fact it'd be a full time job, as it was for me.

From reading your blog Irf I know that you regard some mossies better than others, Turks over Lebs for example, you rascal! Well here's a group of jolly fellows who are worse!

Here's an article from 2000, read it and tell me are they really worth it.

http://www.mnmed.org/Protected/00MNMED/0012/Ohmans.html

It's from Minnesota, one of the more recent places stupid enough to let thousands of mossies within their borders. It places a more or less positive spin on them even though they describe some pretty horrifying things like 'genital cutting. Yes I know, it's not an exclusively islamic practice, it's not as common here but I've talked to midwives and nurses here and they tell me that mutilated women are exclusively mossie.

The article even gives handy hints on how to de-infibulate somali women when her baby's head is crowning, that scar tissue can be pretty stubborn you know.

But at least we have an 'education centre'

http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2003/10/30/1067233290466.html?from=storyrhs

They also talk about TB, many taxi drivers in Minneapolis are Somali, tell me, would you catch a cab over there if the driver was coughing away? Would you want your child sharing a class with them? The spores can last a long time.

I could give you many more articles from the same place but this is enough.

I know I'm an armchair nazi and it's off topic.

G'day,

My invitation is open to you. I have answered your queries. You have refused to accept them. You ask me to find one nice thing to say about Islam. Just about every article I have written on this website illustrates the goodness in Islam. The fact that I can find goodness in other faiths is a reflection of the theology I was taught.

dee, so what if you have one Muslim friend. What does it prove? In a city of over 150,000 Muslims, you could only find one Muslim friend?

I repeat my invitation to you. I promise I won't bite. If you are scared I will terrorise you, I can even arrange a police escort for you. If you are keen to move beyond carping from the sidelines, I am happy to show you around some mosques and schools.

On the other hand, if you wish to remain sinking in the quicksands of hatred, you can refuse my offer and remain in your sheltered suburb.