Persius, this is really a personal, patronising question! My family is huge. There are many siblings right around the country. We all know what happened to Grandad, and Grandma and my eldest aunt were also witnesses. So were many others in Werribee. We respect our elders in courtesy and we treasured their diaries and letters. It is all there in writing.

How many graves did you dance on for the sake of your sarcasm? Your theory of the police making up stories on the stolen generation is insulting.

@PTBI, what is with these Australians? I dared to listen to an Indonesian. Now the Aussie thugs are attacking me as: "the Kaffer Lover".

My Grandfather owned an orchid behind the Churnside Mansion: Werribee Park. You can look up his land title in the archives. He lived in the 1880s and died in the early 20th century. He was old when he had my mother, had 10 children, mother: the youngest.

Likewise, my mother had 9 children. She was old when she had me: the youngest. I am no "whipper-snapper". Grandad did not poison, shoot Aborigines, and push around the Irish for their selections. But he did lose everything for standing righteously for the Aboriginal people being killed.

Of course, the Churnside’s claimed the orchids with the help of the Victorian Government. They confiscating the property from our "traitorous" family: everything they owned. They expanded their polo fields that were covered in the blood from the beheaded Aboriginal "vermin". The same polo fields frequented by the Royal Family.

These images of blood fields inspired HG Wells, when he studied the massacres in Australia. He was so horrified, he wrote "The War of the Worlds".

So now you know. Those fox hunting paintings at Werribee Park have nothing to do with hunting foxes. The game was about hunting the "niggers" in the style of the fox hunt.

Then you sneer about "saints" because of my tag. I answered your question, now it is my turn. Lets talk about your Grand parents, and let me shame them with unkind innuendos and sarcasm.

You would be pleased to learn, Saintfletcher, that recent changes to the defamation legislation have removed any controls over defaming the dead. So you are free to publish all your documentary evidence. In fact, you were always free to do so if the assertions were capable of substantiation and amounted to "fair comment" on a matter of history. Has your family ever presented your claimed evidence to an historian for proper assessment etc?

At the moment you have only provided hearsay and an assertion that no foxes were hunted in the place portrayed in certain paintings. And you have only given very generalised references to the 1880's yet, most of the Western Districts of Victoria were settled and cleared in the 1850's and 60's.

And it is quite clear that anyone seriously claiming that severed heads were used for Polo has never actually played the game or even attended one. This is not to say that massacres did not happen in a world that, at that time, was primarily "nasty, british and short".

My Great Grandfather was the first to settle in his district (1882)and both Grandfathers were selectors and there is no doubt that the majority of farmers, particularly those on the edge of the settlement envelope, were actually heavily reliant on blackfellas as their most available source of farm labour.

So this demonisation of settlers as indiscriminate killers has no basis in fact. The times were hard, people knew hunger as a constant visitor, and many cracked under the conditions. And the Ivan Millats and Martin Bryants of that time had a more convenient target in their blackfella neighbours.

Perseus my mate,

I did say in general some time ago, that not is all what appears to be seen on the surface. You appear to be intelligent, but maybe sometimes you can not see the forest for the trees - like small spelling errors and out of context comments

Before you get your tits in a twist over what some people say without substantiation, go to this link and read just how easy it really is to adopt, how easy it is not to obtain small scraps of information on how to build a Ford - but wind up with a Skoda ..... but remember it is so very easy to divide and rule, unless you do see the trees OK?

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0553266306/sr=8-2/qid=1148272350/ref=pd_bbs_2/103-4307419-6817457?%5Fencoding=UTF8

@Ludwig
The split of East Timor from Indonesia actually agreed by most indonesians who didn't want to see anymore life wasted monthly at those regions for unknown reason. The government didnt get strong opposition to the decision, except from the militaries.

As for Aceh, many Indonesians dont have problem with giving them referendum, but usually they are softening the idea to "special autonomy", just to respect other's sensitivity. And those regions has been cooled down now, and you can see that peace is a reality now there.

West Papua issue is less complex, but it may not be the easier. The Acehnese are in a state that they can actualize the special autonomy given to them, because the people are relatively more educated, skilled and "capable" in managing such chance, and to certain degree make them satisfied. (Since 2001, both provinces got special autonomy).

For now, special autonomy is still questionable if it has made change in Papua. Yearly Jakarta allocates 200 - 300 million USD to the provinces yet I doubt if the money wouldn't vanish to the open air if they couldnt make it work.

Papuan needs solutions on social and cultural issues no less than on political issues. Not necessarily a free state is at the first priority. Independence activists must realize this. And any foreigners must let them grow naturally and find their own science of freedom, not the one they invents and try to market.

@saintfletcher:

Indeed, it is very sad that many white Australians continue to deny the reality of genocide experienced by the Aborigines. It is even sadder many supposedly "educated" whites here seek to justify this genocide and theft of land, by demonising and dehumanising all Aborigines as uncivilised child-abusers who don't "deserve" Australia, the land they've lived on for 50,000 years.

Do not despair, my friend. Disregard those who seek to bully and assault you, continue thy honorable efforts to disclose the truth of white genocide against Aborigines! So no more such genocide can be repeated! Never again!

@Ludwig:

East Timor was not part of Netherlands Indies. Indonesia's original claim in 1945 is on all territories of old Netherlands Indies territory. We will never allow any separatism within these borders. This is final and not negotiable, a basic tenet of our nationhood that we will defend to our last drop of blood and our last gasp of breath. On territories outside old Netherlands Indies, we are free to annex and expel them from our republic according to needs of the times (in case of East Timor, to prevent establishment of communist state there during Cold War).

You really want to protect our national interests?

DON"T LET IEMMA SELL THE SNOWY.

1. Indonesia/Jakarta are cuddly puppies compared to Iemma and Howard who for short term gains are willing to sell our precious water to Monsanto/Soylent company. They have the will to own our food and water. Where will we be then eh? We already know from the X City Funnel Tunnel that the Government promise of regulating the OWNERS of the Snowy is a hollow ruse. Ex Individual Government officials at the highest level are already on the board of these large global ccorporations. What about current ministers? They cannot be trusted.

2. Investors are today being plied in the Herald with Prospectuses for the Snowy Sale. DON"T DO IT. JUST DON"T DO IT. Apart from the immorality of selling your rights along with your country, how do you expect to make long term passable dividends when the corporations in question are free to grant whatever obscene Macquarie Bank style bonuses to themselves that they see fit.