RAncitas... at least my input is variations on the one theme :) I do actually put things differently at times.. Alch just puts on his Hitler suit :) and rants.. 1/ The 'religious' this.. 2/ the 'religious' that.. 3/ return to '1' etc..

More seriously though, your quip about being surprised that Remy is a baptist says quite a bit about your mental image of what 'Baptists' are like.. I'll educate you me boy :)

There are "Independant" Baptists, which usually follow a more hyper fundamental, American style legalistic approach to things Christian, including more rigidness about dress etc. Then there the Bappo's in the Baptist Union of Australia, where they are more 'user friendly' so to speak. They are more 'home grown'.

I really think some of you cynics, specially Col Rouge, who seems to be fixated on the idea that 'Christians' are locked into this idea of needing some 'intercessory priest' to mediate between them and God.
Again.. an unfortunate stereotype more related to his own cultural experience.

BOTH of you need to get out more :) ! and look around at how 'Faith in Christ' is expressed in various traditions (most of which are 'right' but different) and see how things work. They range from small home groups, (Bible studies or house churches) to the more Liturgical (some would say 'lethargical' :) like the Anglicans or Lutherans... Personally, I find very little real spiritual life in the non evangelical 'social action' type churches, most of which are fading. Then of course we have the Hill Song crowd and many variations on that theme, sadly often characterized by a 'prosperity' gospel rather than the real one.

But, as Paul said "Some preach Christ out of envy, hoping to cause me trouble, others out of sincerity, but for me, as long as Christ is preached, in this I rejoice"

THE POINT
The point Remy has been making seems to have been lost so far on most posters, and that is the beautiful unity and harmony which exists across racial and cultural borders for those 'In Christ'.

I,m starting to worry about you Rancitas.(Humour intended)

BD - "The point Remy has been making seems to have been lost so far on most posters, and that is the beautiful unity and harmony which exists across racial and cultural borders for those 'In Christ'."

The point you might miss is that many of us outside of the group 'In Christ' have seen both sides of that fence and know that the propaganda the church tells itself is just that propaganda.

Inside and outside the church people act in ways good and bad. As Remy points out the christain churches history is not all that flash in this area. Claiming that being 'In Christ' puts you in a special position for unity and harmony is just not true. You might tell yourself that, being in a mixed race marriage and if I understand earlier comments correctly mixing with a number of other couples with mixed race marriages may be giving you an unbalanced view on the broader situation.

Maybe time for you 'to get out more :) ! and look around at how' many people 'Outside Christ' really live. Not just look at the worst case scenarios but across the board. Some do well, some do badly just like in the church.

I'm clearing out shortly for a holiday so probably won't be around for any response but it will take a while for you to have an honest look around outside Christ and see that it's not all bad.

R0bert

While you Christians and Muslims work on the dificult project of figuring out how not to kill each other, can the rest of us get on with things without you?

Robert,
You've made the mistake assuming Christians have always been "Christian" were baptised infants and have never known anything other than the inside of a Church. The fact is many have been saved from decadent anti-god lives. They've seen both sides of the ledger and prefer to follow Christ - read the KIROS stories.
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Quote Robert, "The point you might miss is that many of us outside of the group 'In Christ' have seen both sides of that fence and know that the propaganda the church tells itself is just that propaganda. Inside and outside the church people act in ways good and bad. As Remy points out the Christian churches history is not all that flash in this area. Claiming that being 'In Christ' puts you in a special position for unity and harmony is just not true."
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May you come to understand what being "in Christ" means. The term "in Christ" is not a general term for attending or being on the Roll of a Church or claiming to be Christian in a generic sense.

The term "Christ" is the Greek word for the office of "Messiah" in the Hebrew language and refers to a position of character, title, office or authority. Jesus holds that position in the kingdom of God.

If one is "in Christ" it means they act within the authority and character of that anointed office. In the Biblical sense is an appointment bestowed by God and represents the truth of God to the people, essentially as their saviour.

Though in the Roman Christian mind it might have been identified with the head of the religious State or venerated Saints. In the kingdom of God it is identified with the spiritual qualities of expressing the pure character of God to people. It's in this sense that Jesus is identified as expressing the very character and attitudes of God - God is father of his spirit. Hence his identity as - son of God. For one to be "in Christ" means having the same spirit as God where the old self-centered behaviours have gone.

BD, you know that Hitler was a right wing christian and I am neither. You try to flippantly avoid the truth and change the subject, accusing me of ranting. Does the truth hurt that much. It must be terribly infuriating to be so inadequate, knowing you are so unlearnt about what you passionately believe in, yet afraid to accept truth.

“the beautiful unity and harmony which exists across racial and cultural borders for those 'In Christ'.”

Explain, Ireland, Sth America, the USA, most christian African countries, Pacific Islands and the thousands of past christians cultural and religious conflicts that still simmer, knights templar come to mind.

Now we have the great Christian USA, which I believe your church comes from, about to take over Iran to get their oil, very caring and harmonious.

There would probably be more harmony in christianity, if you utilised holy anointing oil, as used to heal by your apostles.

Like muslims and Jews, you cannot justify nor provide factual evidence to support your illusions, never honestly answering questions, just try to delude us.

Philo, For someone that I feel has made a point of studying your religion, why can't you accept the truth that sits before you. How do you explain the massive difference between what you all say and what is historically written. I understand those that just look at the book or get sucked in by some selfcentred crank preacher, with out investigation.

Your god and christ must be very dissapointed at the example you all provide, no wonder he won't come back.