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Fairness and equality are not the same thing : Comments
By Steven Schwartz, published 5/4/2022Engineering equality is neither achievable nor desirable; it isn't even fair.
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Posted by Yuyutsu, Tuesday, 5 April 2022 10:53:39 PM
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Alan B - you wrote "nobody is even considering engineered equality outcomes" but that's exactly what the currently dominant political forces in the western world are demanding. BLM, Extinction Rebellion, Cancel Culture, aspects of the LBGQI+ movement - they all want their preferred outcomes without the effort of using the opportunities that exist in our largely free planet. Even Biden and his crew in the USA are relying on MMT to engineer a monetary outcome that is largely responsible for the current high inflation.
Posted by Bernie Masters, Tuesday, 5 April 2022 11:11:36 PM
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I believe in capitalism, just not the extreme capitalism of the average rogue employer.
Alan B, That extreme is the most destructive decease in the history & future of this world. Most of the super wealthy suffer from that alongside the massive hordes of public service bureaucrats. I don't know the scientific term of this decease but the common term is GREED ! The Academic elite's agenda is to promote this non-contributing sector of society as vital by pretending to be part of the learned, useful & desirable professional circles. This con has enabled this crowd to worm itself in the taxpayer funded very comfortable "middle class" for literally nothing in return ! Posted by individual, Wednesday, 6 April 2022 8:30:55 AM
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Yuyutsu-
It's satisfying that you see the population problem- there are several wise visionaries on OLO that see the problem- but sadly many on the outside don't. In answer to your question. Thanks for your question- It's a bit rough and I haven't been able to find the quote- but the following demonstrates the point I believe. http://www.azquotes.com/author/524-Aristotle/tag/self-esteem Happiness does not consist in pastimes and amusements but in virtuous activities- Aristotle Ayn Rand on Self Esteem http://aynrandlexicon.com/lexicon/self-esteem.html From Galt's Speech- "Every act of man’s life has to be willed; the mere act of obtaining or eating his food implies that the person he preserves is worthy of being preserved; every pleasure he seeks to enjoy implies that the person who seeks it is worthy of finding enjoyment. He has no choice about his need of self-esteem, his only choice is the standard by which to gauge it. And he makes his fatal error when he switches this gauge protecting his life into the service of his own destruction, when he chooses a standard contradicting existence and sets his self-esteem against reality." Aristotle is associated with these... https://academyofideas.com/2015/11/introduction-to-aristotle-knowledge-and-the-four-causes/ ‘…one should have surveyed all the difficulties beforehand because people who inquire without first stating the difficulties are like those who do not know where they have to go.’ “. . .it is not insofar as he is man that he will live [a life of contemplation], but in so far as something divine is present in him. . . If intellect is divine, then, in comparison with man, the life according to it is divine in comparison with human life. But we must not follow those who advise us, being men, to think of human things, and, being mortal, of mortal things, but must, so far as we can, make ourselves immortal, and strain every nerve to live in accordance with the best thing in us; for even if it be small in bulk, much more does it in power and worth surpass everything.” (Nicomachean Ethics) https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/aristotle-causality/ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metaphysics#Etymology http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Causality Search terms you could use are Cause and Effect Aristotle Fun/ Self Esteem Posted by Canem Malum, Wednesday, 6 April 2022 10:48:42 AM
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I may have remembered the item about Aristotle from book on Objectivism, Fountainhead, commentary- but permeates Atlas Shrugged allegory. I've been unable to lay my hands on the exact quote but include it in future posts.
I've made a project of absorbing the meaning of Atlas Shrugged through many many attempts so I expect that someone who has only read it one or two times wouldn't have a thorough sense of the story. Text of Atlas Shrugged http://archive.org/stream/AtlasShrugged/atlas%20shrugged_djvu.txt "So you think that money is the root of all evil?" said Francisco d'Anconia. "Have you ever asked what is the root of money? "Money is your means of survival. The verdict you pronounce upon the source of your livelihood is the verdict you pronounce upon your life. If the source is corrupt, you have damned your own existence. Did you get your money by fraud? By pandering to men's vices or men's stupidity? By catering to fools, in the hope of getting more than your ability deserves? By lowering your standards? By doing work you despise for purchasers you scorn? If so, then your money will not give you a moment's or a penny's worth of joy. Then all the things you buy will become, not a tribute to you, but a reproach; not an achievement, but a reminder of shame. Then you'll scream that money is evil. Evil, because it would not pinch-hit for your self-respect? Evil, because it would not let you enjoy your depravity? Is this the root of your hatred of money? "Money will always remain an effect and refuse to replace you as the cause. Money is the product of virtue, but it will not give you virtue and it will not redeem your vices. Money will not give you the unearned, neither in matter nor in spirit. Is this the root of your hatred of money? James Taggart when he dates Betty Pope and Cheryl Brooks doesn't "feel" anything but a dull sensation- he doesn't care about sex- and he seems generally bored with life- the implication is that people such as James don't feel Posted by Canem Malum, Wednesday, 6 April 2022 10:51:25 AM
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When James Taggart talks to Dagny Taggart about the Rio Norte line supporting critical production in Colorado- James provokes Dagny by saying "not everybody can think about engines and locomotives- you don't feel anything" Dagny says sarcastically in reply "you're right I don't feel anything". James could never understand real feeling because his existence is essentially a denial of thinking, feeling, reality and life in general.
At one of the parties perhaps either 1. Reardon's Wedding Anniversary or 2. Jame's Taggart's wedding- Dagny and Hank talk about most people ie looters and moochers- don't know how to enjoy themselves. When Dagny and Henry are intimate the implication is that- it is right to feel strongly and engage in intimacy because they had been greatly productive together in the creation of the superlative John Galt Line. Cause and Effect. http://www.atlassociety.org/post/the-best-within-us A cardinal principle of the Objectivist ethics is that, in Ayn Rand’s words, “productive work is the central purpose of a rational man’s life, the central value that integrates and determines the hierarchy of all his other values.” Eddie Willers recalls a childhood conversation with Dagny Taggart- "To hold achievement as a global value is to take satisfaction in the act of building, making, discovering, solving problems." Fountainhead- Finally, of course, there are people who work for the sake of achievement, who take intrinsic satisfaction in the act of producing and for whom all other rewards are secondary. Howard Roark to Keating “You’ll get everything society can give a man. You’ll keep all the money. You’ll take any fame or honor anyone might want to grant. You’ll accept such gratitude as the tenants might feel. And I—I’ll take what nobody can give a man, except himself. I will have built Cortlandt.” ENJOYMENT To hold enjoyment as a global value is to operate on the principle of hedonism. This view of life is not limited to those who seek constant stimulation by food, drink, and sex. The Greek philosopher Epicurus said that we should seek enjoyment in serenity, a quiet life of moderate pleasures. Posted by Canem Malum, Wednesday, 6 April 2022 9:47:08 PM
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Yes the underlying problem is population numbers: no amount of tinkering around the ages, economically, politically and/or environmentally is going to make a dent in that.
For any real improvement, human population on this planet ought to be brought back down to around 100-200 million people.
«Atlas Shrugged talked about putting pleasure before productivity in contradiction to nature»
I read the book and cannot recall where it does so.
Can you please point me to it?
The book certainly speaks of principles-before-productivity, dignity-before-productivity and independence-before-productivity, but pleasure too?