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The Forum > Article Comments > Kabul: some good must come of this > Comments

Kabul: some good must come of this : Comments

By Graham Young, published 19/8/2021

What we are seeing in Afghanistan is an international version of defunding the police. This is Portland Oregon or Kenosha, just with a broader canvass and even more elemental actors.

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Dear mhaze,

Rubbish. It should have been written like this:

The Afghan military blame the Americans.
The UK parliament blames Americans.
The Europeans blame the Americans.
The US military blame the administrations.
The CIA blame the administrations.

Biden was quite clear about his decision:

“When I came into office, I inherited a deal that President Trump negotiated with the Taliban. Under his agreement, U.S. forces would be out of Afghanistan by May 1, 2021. The choice I had to make as your president was either to follow through on that agreement or be prepared to go back to fighting the Taliban in the middle of the spring fighting season. It was only a cold reality of either following through on the agreement to withdraw our forces or escalating the conflict, and sending thousands more American troops back into combat in Afghanistan, lurching into the third decade of conflict. I stand squarely behind my decision.”

As the NY Times reports:

“Intelligence agencies have long predicted an ultimate Taliban victory, even before President Donald J. Trump and Mr. Biden decided to withdraw forces. Those estimates provided a range of timelines. While they raised questions about the will of the Afghan security forces to fight without Americans by their side, they did not predict a collapse within weeks.
But in recent months, assessments became ever more pessimistic as the Taliban made larger gains, according to current and former officials. The reports this summer questioned in stark terms the will of Afghan security forces to fight and the ability of the Kabul government to hold power. With each report of mass desertions, a former official said, the Afghan government looked less stable.”

So we have a few poms and Europeans saying the Yanks should not have withdrawn, that the country should not have been given up to the Taliban. I don't see any American quotes from you. I suspect that is because the withdrawal has reasonably wide spread support in that country.

shadowminister,

Your president basically handed the place to the Taliban. Do you support his decision or not?
Posted by SteeleRedux, Tuesday, 24 August 2021 6:48:41 PM
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SR,

Your addled president handed Afghanistan to the Taliban.

Do you support his monumental cock up.
Posted by shadowminister, Wednesday, 25 August 2021 5:05:25 AM
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So now we have SR just re-writing history.

For example, the Afghans say specifically that Biden abandoned them and SR just re-writes that to have them saying the American abandoned them which SR then twists to mean Trump abandoned them.

Its a strange way to look at the world. IF the world doesn't comply with the way you want it to be, just re-imagine it and demand that that is the way it really is.

Some more examples of people seeing the world for what it is rather than the way SR wants it to be....

"Susan Rice has been telling allies on the Hill that this is one of the most incompetent national security disasters in American history, said Obama’s “f$$k up” quote is an understatement now."

For those who don't know, Susan Rice was one of the Obamessiah's spokespersons and is now one of Biden's closest advisors. The "f$$k up" quote is where Obama advised "Don't underestimate Joe's ability to f$$k things up".

"Historians aren’t actually sure that Nero caused or neglected a fire that consumed much of ancient Rome. Historians, however much they’d like to, won’t be able to deny that President Joe Biden bears full responsibility for America’s humiliating retreat from Afghanistan and our neglect of the tens of thousands who aided us and now face torture and death from the Taliban."

"Bret Stephens writes that “every enemy will draw the lesson that the United States is a feckless power,” and “every ally — Taiwan, the Baltic States, Israel, Japan — will draw the lesson that it is on its own.”
Posted by mhaze, Wednesday, 25 August 2021 1:09:15 PM
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“Aug. 18, 2020 — In releasing a report that covered activity in Afghanistan from April 1, 2020, to June 30, 2020, the Defense Department inspector general’s office says, “The Taliban did not appear to uphold its commitment to distance itself from terrorist organizations in Afghanistan. UN and U.S. officials reported that the Taliban continued to support al-Qaeda, and conducted joint attacks with al-Qaeda members against Afghan National Defense and Security Forces.”
Factcheck.org

So much for your assurances earlier.

Washington Post: “It was Trump’s fondest hope — or dangerous obsession — in his final days in office to withdraw the last U.S. troops from Afghanistan, as the fulfillment of his “America First” ideals. In November 2020, as Trump fought his flailing battle to void the results of a presidential election, he signed an executive order mandating that U.S. troops leave Afghanistan by Jan. 15, 2021.”

Just imagine the bum fight had that happened.

And this from you: "Susan Rice has been telling allies on the Hill that this is one of the most incompetent national security disasters in American history, said Obama’s “f$$k up” quote is an understatement now."
Little commentary snippets from a far right pundits twitter feed are hardly anything to hang your hat on are they?

So mate, you still haven't told us how this scenario would have gone down given Trump's executive order to have troops out in January?
Posted by SteeleRedux, Wednesday, 25 August 2021 3:03:11 PM
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SR,

How this would have played out under Trump is a moot point. Trump may or may not have made the same mistakes, but was not in charge.

Biden however, cocked up royally and on top of that instead of being contrite tried to blame everyone else. The result is that his ratings are plummeting.
Posted by shadowminister, Thursday, 26 August 2021 2:25:39 PM
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