DreamOn,

I don’t remember what cultures/legal systems outlawed incest with that in mind, sorry.

Regarding the origins of incest avoidance, to me it seems unlikely that we could become so repulsed by the thought of incest purely through social conditioning.

Some of the papers listed here discuss the possible evolutionary origins of incest avoidance:

http://scholar.google.com.au/scholar?q=evolution+incest&btnG=&hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C5

Here’s a paper that discusses it specifically:

http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.140.8222&rep=rep1&type=pdf

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phanto,

You’re not getting into amateur physiology now, are you?

<<… all you need to know is some basic physiology.>>

Perhaps if you’d gotten into amateur neuroscience, then you would understand that there is a lot more to sexual arousal than the number of nerve endings involved. How else do you explain the enhanced pleasure that role play and pornography can provide couples with?

Toni Lavis:

"What are the essential differences between male and female oral cavities"

It doesn't really matter. My claim is that the most pleasurable sex is the sex that you engage in which can lead to procreation. Behaviour which can never lead to procreation can never be the most pleasurable.

Your claim is that oral sex is the best possible sexual pleasure. If that is the best then why would anyone bother to choose sexual behaviour where their genitals come together? How would 'nature' ensure the continuation of the species if it created oral sex as the most desirable choice?

You seem to have a problem with just accepting the way we have been created. It doesn't mean that other behaviours are bad or wrong - it just means that they are not the best. What is the problem with having one type of behaviour as the best? Why would it bother homosexuals that they cannot have the best of sexual experiences

DreamOn:

"So, it would not surprise me at all to learn at a future point from legitimate science that indeed some people are hard wired (at least at an instinctive level) to be attracted to individuals of the same sex."

All of us are hardwired to be attracted to individuals of the same sex. You do not need a study to work that out. Being attracted to them and having sex with them are two entirely different issues. People are attracted to others for a whole range of reasons but none of them are sexual. Attraction brings us together and we want to be with those to whom we are attracted. We can be attracted to children because they can be very delightful to be with but we do not have sex with them. Having sex is a choice. We choose whether or not to have sex with the person we are attracted to. We do not have sex with everyone we are attracted to because other things also come into consideration.

One of those things that we should consider is what is the best type of sexual experience. If we can have the best sexual experience with someone we find attractive to be with then we would be stupid to pursue anything else. Homosexual people settle for something far less than the best and this is sad.They do not even go looking for the best.

Phanto, I think that you have gone from the sublime to the ridiculous in an exercise in splitting hairs and have lost the point of what was said.

Further, sex is not always a choice and

how can it be sad if two people are Lovers and their Love for one another goes beyond mere sex as only part of a wider more fulfilling relationship?

And I do not believe that you have made the case, and nor has it been conceded, that hetero intercourse is the best form of sex as here again, you are dealing with the tastes of the individual and there is an exceedingly large range of diversity in that area.

..

AJ, I think that I need to meet you half way on the "evolutionary basis for incest repulsion" as it appears that some animals do have incest repulsion (eg Bonobos) and some don't (Chimpanzees and dogs) and likewise with people, some do and some don't.

..

http://chimpanzeeinformation.blogspot.com.au/2010/12/sex-differences-between-bonobo-apes-and.html

" ... So whence comes our preoccupation with exclusivity and monogamy? That’s a tougher question to answer, and it involves a certain amount of guesswork. But make no mistake — the facts are the facts, and our interpretation must not make light of them, nor may it brush them casually aside. The thing that makes human sexuality different from animal sexuality is precisely that we are obsessed with it, that we desire it with many different people, and that we use it for social purposes as much or more than the animals. If you want to have sex like an animal, lose your sex drive and only do it when you want a baby.
Sources:
de Waal, F. (2005) Our Inner Ape: The Best and Worst of Human Nature. London: Granta Books.
Ryan, C and Cacilda, J. (2010) Sex at Dawn: The Prehistoric Origins of Modern Sexuality. U.S: HarperCollins. ... "

phanto,

You still have not yet justified this claim.

<<Behaviour which can never lead to procreation can never be the most pleasurable.>>

Your measure of what constitutes the ‘most pleasurable’ shifts around with your ducking and weaving too.

<<If [oral sex] is the best then why would anyone bother to choose sexual behaviour where their genitals come together?>>

For variety.

<<How would 'nature' ensure the continuation of the species if it created oral sex as the most desirable choice?>>

Well it's done a pretty good job given that not everyone agrees that heterosexual vaginal sex is the best form of sex, so oral sex being the best form of sex wouldn't be much of a hindrance given our desire for variety that you failed to take into account.

Your argument is a fallacious appeal to nature.

Most people would stop digging when their argument had been defeated. Not you though, phanto. Your arguments just become increasingly bizarre. Obviously it's very important to you that you be right on this topic

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DreamOn,

I think that's a good compromise. There doesn't seem to be a definitive answer one way or the other.

DreamOn:

"Further, sex is not always a choice "

When is it not a choice? Even rape requires at least the rapist to make a choice.

"how can it be sad if two people are Lovers and their Love for one another goes beyond mere sex as only part of a wider more fulfilling relationship? "

Heterosexual people can have all that as well as the best of sexual experiences so it is sad that homosexual people lose out. All human beings should have what is best and the loss of what is best leads to sadness.

"And I do not believe that you have made the case, and nor has it been conceded, that hetero intercourse is the best form of sex"

Nor have you made a case to the contrary.

"as here again, you are dealing with the tastes of the individual and there is an exceedingly large range of diversity in that area."

There might be a wide range of behaviours but what is wrong with judging one experience to be the best? The only ones that would be bothered by that are those who fear they may be missing out.