The Forum > Article Comments > The right to sexual fulfilment: a privileged gunman, misogyny and social comparisons > Comments
The right to sexual fulfilment: a privileged gunman, misogyny and social comparisons : Comments
By Rob Cover, published 26/5/2014By any measure the Santa Barbara shooter was privileged, but apparently privilege isn't enough.
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Posted by RobCover, Tuesday, 27 May 2014 12:50:28 PM
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HEYJ/QUOTE..<<..There is no reliable evidence that violent media causes violent behaviour,>>.
gezz/mate..im not sure about you/but porno makes us horny thats why some people watch em//so only do gooders watch violence movies/come on son/dreamers wankerrs fighters and thugs love getting new ideas from movies lest we forget much 'erRor/was first done on screen i recall a plaNe hitting a tower/i\recall roberies copy cat you just need record your own righteous anger/on an actor[yet go ask how many dumbo's there are that think movies are real youR WORDS ARE MUCH LIKE THE RESULTS THEY GOT AT QUANTONIMO BAY THE NUMBVERS MAH HAVE A BIAS[AND THE INFO APPEARS UNSOURCED/IE ITS ORPHan/still born <<> and there is actually some evidence to suggest that violent media provides an outlet for people with a propensity to commit violent acts>> yes where the heart goes the fist goes its amasing how fear makes some horny[its sickness..our emotion attrtact demons/kids have nightmares/woman get raped//idiots get ideas[to think it is as good as doing it/spiritualy/if you wanted/to..you sinned..in your heart[you cant be half preggers.] thuswatch thuggery[police love cops shows/judge shows train judges and tv id your master..sport nuts dont watrch sport/because real sportsman/oplay sport/not watch it[those weakling/no bodies/who want a gun/just so they too can say/make my day/the truth yopu cant handle the truth//i love the smelL OF GUTS AND BLOOD /I DRINK BLOOD/eat flesh/its insane..any fool will see two fat overweight dudes bAshing each others heads in..and know their..in church? OR THE DEMONS KILLING IN GODS HOLY LANDS insanity/one more pill wont hurt ONLY/one More sip..one PUNCH CAN KIll..WAR MONGRELS WATCH WAR MOVIES/LOVERS WATCH LOVE..STORIES..KIDS LOVE KIDDY TALES. POLITICOS lOVE POLICIAL MAGAZINES..its not complicated we buy stuff that feeds our passion...rather selfish/but such IS WHAT WE ARE. we hire trainers to train us in our passion help us find ourselves/the absurdity/THAT WE WATCH VIOLENCE TO FEEL PEACE/ISNT HARD FAST FACT. Posted by one under god, Tuesday, 27 May 2014 1:32:28 PM
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A LUST to murder/must begin in our heart
but what the minds sees it knows once it knows what it likes it want more ITS NOT OVER COMPLICATED/..if/YOUR WATCHING KIDIE PERVERSION/YOUR A KIDDY PERVERT[SIMPLES]//WE BECOME THAT WE CONSUME. <<>...the liberalisationof violent media that began..in the early seventies.when the overall crime trend has actually declined i..>> THE STUFF THAT SEPPEWRATED THE GENERATIONS/AWAY FROM PARENTAL GUIDENCE <<..And while assault rates are up,>>> SOCCER RIOTS ONLY OCCUR AFTER SOCCER MATCHES OR OTHER MEDIA PROVOCATION/motivations/we watch marathons/hoping we one day/may run/one[i hate that b//so much i may like watcvhing movies on offing people? i wtch coking shows for ideas/i watch home reno shows/FOR IDEAS/FIGHTERS WATCH PREVIOUS FIGHTS TO FIND WAYS TO LOOSE ONLY LOOSERS NEVER WIN ONLY WINNERS NEVER WHIME <<..the only evidence of causation between these increases in assault and violent media is the backfiring effect that our now more profound condemnation of violence..(which is possibly, and ironically, in part due to the increased viewing of violent media) can have.>> ONLY BEAST WATCH BEAST PORN* LINKAGE IS EVERYTHING/KNOW WHAT A PERSON LOVES TO DO/we know you we see you love porn sites..that dsont mean much/till we see its all boys...if we watching it/we rather be 'doing'..it/stop pretending vilence dont make more vile[not even real vile/just pretend vile[its sick]. show me thy libery//i know the man sjow me your music...by this your are knowable show me your beloved drink//your favourded food..im eating lobster cause i really wanted bay bugs...[yeah right] Posted by one under god, Tuesday, 27 May 2014 1:37:26 PM
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It always seems to amaze me how writers only think of the problem at hand, I for one do not condone what this young man did, nor do I condone the USA killing many innocent men women and children in war, we must remember America is gun happy whether in war or peacetime. Where is the difference one legal, one illegal? remember I was taught to kill brutally with a 303 rifle and to yell & scream as I plunged the bayonet into a chaff bag resembling a body, but of course this was legal madness and is still being practised today.
Posted by Ojnab, Tuesday, 27 May 2014 2:07:21 PM
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Rob Cover,
Short answer, we don't know to what extent his environment influenced his state of mind because we only have the writings penned when he had clearly gone over the edge of the abyss, I don't see how we can trust his account of his upbringing. All in all it's a sordid story. His family have since indicated that there was no diagnosis of Asbergers and one suspects that their lawyers are doing a lot of butt covering besides, maybe he wasn't getting treatment? There are posts online which are probably by Rodger but which can't be verified that apparently contain some fairly horrific allegations of abuse by his stepmother and it's alleged that his father and stepmother also posted their home made pornography online, which also he might have seen. Broadly speaking the thread linking misogynistic spree and some serial killers is maternal abuse or abuse by female carers, it's actually ubiquitous in their accounts of their lives. Your questions are valid but I don't think we can get any answers from Elliot Rodgers, you'd be better off studying some spree killers or killers of women who didn't suicide and were studied while in custody, Peter Dupas for example or the case of Richard Speck: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6vAn0p2iVyM Posted by Jay Of Melbourne, Tuesday, 27 May 2014 2:26:30 PM
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Rob Cover : “What is necessary, however, is to ask the question of what puts him into the “bubble”? What stresses, what kinds of situations, what ways of thinking about himself in relation to others position him to lash out?”
What if none of those reasons relate to misogyny, sexual fulfilment, peer pressure or sense of entitlement? You are basing your results on the evidence of his diary or YouTube or other public utterances. You are taking his interpretation of his behaviour and giving it a credence which at the very least is extremely unscientific. The fact is you do not have anywhere near enough reliable information to make such a conclusive diagnosis of what was happening in his mind. You want the cause of his behaviour to be bad attitudes to women and sex and entitlement because those things are important to you. Those things are important to a great many people in our society but they argue their point by using reason and logic and not trying to influence any debate by attempting to append guilt where none is appropriate. You are in effect saying, without any intimate knowledge of this young man, that society is to blame for his actions. You hope that the part of society which harbours negative attitudes to women or sex or entitlement will be shamed into changing those attitudes because the result is that unstable people are driven to this kind of behaviour. If there are pockets of society which harbour negative attitudes which you seem to attribute to this young man then they should change those attitudes because it is reasonable and logical to do so. This is the only way lasting and true change comes about. Trying to get them to change by heaping upon them a guilt trip which is totally unwarranted is a desperate measure and smacks of some personal agenda. Posted by phanto, Tuesday, 27 May 2014 3:45:34 PM
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If we simply argue that people who do horrendous things are just “crazy” (mentally imbalanced, psychiatrically disturbed) and leave it at that, then we’re looking in the wrong direction and we’re failing to address the problem.
In “coming to the conclusion that Elliot Rodger was simply a kid who'd slowly gone insane” we’re failing precisely to ask about:
1. What are the social pressures that drove him to ‘behave insanely’ (those pressures may have been going on for a long time in his life, as his manifesto would indicate, although remember that it is not a diary but written at a particular point-in-time)
2. What are the nuanced, complex, complicated and awkward ways in which people are positioned, relative to others, that can have such an effect.
Of course Elliot Rodger had very serious mental health issues: that goes without saying in the case of anyone capable of shooting innocent random people. I don’t think anyone is suggesting that this was a conscious, reasoned act.
What is necessary, however, is to ask the question of what puts him into the “bubble”? What stresses, what kinds of situations, what ways of thinking about himself in relation to others position him to lash out?
The necessary work, then, is to ‘come at’ the issue from a range of perspectives in the hope of finding a way to prevent that this kind of horrendous act from happening again.