Loudmouth,

Talking of bullsh!t....
Remember Bush once said that the hardest part of his job was to connect Iraq to the War on Terror - nice slip up that, straight from the horses mouth.

How many people has the U.S. slaughtered in the course of its retributive escapades?

And whose responsibility is that?

Thank you Sam, I appreciate your article and attempt.

I'm not sure whether by "energy" you refer to the common scientific notion which can be physically measured (E=mc2); or to some totally different notion (such as that commonly referred to in New-Age circles).

At the moment of death, all that happens is that we lose contact with the physical world (including its physical energy), so it's essentially back to the way we were before we were born. Whether it's then "all black" or "journey", well sorry I cannot tell, I simply don't remember since my memories are stored in my brain, which I had none at the time (if one can even speak of "time" in that situation).

Poirot, you assume correctly, so then we agree to disagree.

Grim, an attitude of "Godfearing" is not necessarily religious. How can one expect to unite with God if they fear Him instead of love Him?

Your assumptions as if I believe that "1. God exists; 2. God is greater than myself; 3. God has motives and desires" are incorrect. I have previously explained my faith in detail in this forum, but currently the word-limit would not allow it. In just one sentence - THERE IS NOTHING BUT GOD!

Your idea to "stop the cycle of violence" is yours, not Jesus'. While it's too late to ask him now, I believe that Jesus said 'love thine enemy' because he could see God even in an enemy and a trespasser, not in order to achieve some result. At times that approach may work and violence will cease, at other times it won't, but it doesn't matter since even while we must shoot an enemy we can still perceive the divine in them.

Ammonite, I didn't mention dragging. The lady just stared ahead at the road, said nothing and crossed willingly.

"non religious people cannot either be wise or compassionate"

-Perhaps, but I never met anyone who is non-religious: we all come to God at our own pace. Neither concepts nor membership of a religious order are necessary. Everyone is capable of wisdom and compassion.

Hi Poirot,

You were asking, " ... How many people has the U.S. slaughtered in the course of its retributive escapades?

"And whose responsibility is that?"

That's a very good question. Let's see - how can we know how many people have been killed in Iraq by the following entities ?

* the US military

* the US private contractors

* SCIRI and the Badr Brigade

* Moqtada al-Sadr and his army

* al-Qaida

* remnants of the Ba'athist Party

* criminal gangs

* various other Shi'ite, Sunni, Kurdish, etc. groups

There have been a lot of players on the Iraqi stage, Poirot.

Joe

Hey Joe, whether the USA's actions were defensible or not in themselves is immaterial; the part I find objectionable and pertinent to this discussion is that those actions were taken in the name of the Christian God. You remember, the God who gave us such memorable sound bytes as "thou shalt not kill" and "forgive us our trespasses as we forgive them that trespass against us", and "turn the other cheek", and "love your enemy as you love yourself"... Remember Dubya was and is a God fear... oops, I mean a God loving Christian, who reckoned God told him to invade Iraq.
Do you honestly believe the actions of the USA in recent years has lessened the hatred between nations?
Yuyutsu... sigh... So now you reckon love of one's parents is religious, but being 'God fearing' (to coin a phrase that has been in existence long before Jesus was a twinkle in...?) is not religious?
Oh please.
If you're going to base your arguments on your own pet definitions of words already listed in standard dictionaries, perhaps you could share those definitions with us first; or at least explain what is so wrong with the dictionary definitions?

Yuyutsu wrote"I'm not sure whether by "energy" you refer to the common scientific notion which can be physically measured (E=mc2); or to some totally different notion (such as that commonly referred to in New-Age circles)."

Yes and yes...its the same energy...so the energy in the atomic blast over Hiroshima(Einsteins e=mc2 was the focus to science that led to creating atomic bomb) is the same in the food you are going to eat for dinner, and extract energy from it to use in your activities tomorrow...

I think the question you are interested in is..."can energy exist purely as an intelligent entity(aka god and soul)...ie not part of any matter...

and since you speak of god in your posts...it would seem your answer is yes...

hope my previous post now makes more sense...

sam

Dear Sam,

Although energy is a bit subtler than "solid" matter, as Einstein showed us, they are still interchangeable, so I still place energy in the "physical" basket. Our bodies and the food that we eat and what we expend while active, would also be in the same category - they are all interchangeable.

On the other hand, WE - you and me (which you call "soul"), God and consciousness, cannot be interchanged with energy or with matter. We are non-physical.

Intelligence has nothing to do with it: computers for example can also be intelligent - they may be able to deal very efficiently with the physical world, but they are not alive, they are not conscious. We, on the other hand are: we may not be intelligent at times (especially if our brain is dead or damaged), but it does not make us any less alive, it only makes us less able to deal with the physical world.

Grim,

Religion comes from Latin "Re-Ligiere", or re-connect [with God]. It is interesting to note that the word "Yoga" also comes from the root "to yoke" - to connect oneself with God.

So when I mention "religion" I quite simply mean "any method that helps one to re-connect to God, come closer to Him and ultimately unite with Him".

Loving one's parents is a step in the right direction of connecting with God, hence I consider it part of religion. Fearing God, on the other hand, places a barrier between oneself and God, hence it is not a healthy religion.