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The Forum > General Discussion > Two State Solution for Israel and Palestine is not a solution

Two State Solution for Israel and Palestine is not a solution

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Dear Yuyutsu,

It might help if Jews & Arabs could rid themselves of their religious superstitions and their god nonsense. You are probably right. They would rather kill each other than resort to reason.
Posted by david f, Friday, 30 September 2022 2:27:50 PM
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Dear Foxy,

«and force Hamas to chose between its rockets and re-construction.»

Well they have chosen already - rockets!

And just as you observed the bitter internal divisions in the "Palestinian" camp between PLO and Hamas, who are happy to kill each other, I hope that you are aware that similar divisions exist within Israel too.

«Of course the Palestinian issue cannot be dismissed or denied.»

Well, while you personally may not dismiss or deny it, it had been officially put on hold by Israel:

Following the previous Israeli elections, the new coalition partners decided on a cease-fire - no, I didn't mean a cease-fire between Israel and "Palestinians", but between themselves! The terms of this cease-fire include the maintaining of the status-quo in the West Bank, abstaining from any changes or initiatives there in order to be able to concentrate on Israel's other, more pressing internal issues.

Good luck to you if you expect Israelis to suddenly abandon all their burning internal disputes to focus instead on the forgotten issue of those silly "Palestinians" which has now been placed for decades in their too-hard-basket. What could you possibly offer them to entice them to give that any priority?

---

Dear David F.,

«It might help if Jews & Arabs could rid themselves of their religious superstitions and their god nonsense.»

That would be a sufficient condition [for stopping their war], but not a necessary condition. Another sufficient condition (for example) would be to have their arms and legs broken, because then too they would not be able to fight. If it comes to that, then both sides would certainly prefer the latter option.

Can you even convince them to break their arms and legs? or to pluck out their own eyes? because that would be relatively easier!

«They would rather kill each other than resort to reason.»

But they are not being unreasonable:
Reason never dictates objectives, reason can only determine how to obtain one's objectives - and their objectives in life are simply different to yours.
Posted by Yuyutsu, Friday, 30 September 2022 3:32:16 PM
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Hi Yuyutsu,

The United States needs to stop preserving and funding
Israel. When peaceful opposition to Israel's policies
and through pressure on the parties a peaceful solution
is achievable. But too many insist on sparing Israelis
and Palestinians the pain of outside force so that they
may instead continue to be generous with one another in
the suffering they inflict.
Posted by Foxy, Friday, 30 September 2022 4:00:16 PM
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Dear Foxy,

The days when Israel depended on the United States are long gone.

At present, Israel is in many ways stronger than America, its economy is flourishing as America is entering a recession and it produces such weapons which America can only envy, including anti-ballistic equipment capable of stopping the Russian and Chinese super-sonic missiles, which nobody else has, including the United States.

America is becoming increasingly irrelevant. Israel knows it and lately often defies America.

The main danger to Israel is its internal conflicts, not external forces, and what your perceive (and oppose) as Israel's "policies" are just a reflection of its internal struggles.
Do you have a magical wand that can save Israel from itself?
Posted by Yuyutsu, Friday, 30 September 2022 4:27:59 PM
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Hi Yuyutsu,

I beg to differ.

Since World War II Israel has been the largest overall
recipient of US foreign aid. The BBC tell us that in 2020
the US gave $3.8 billion in aid to Israel - part of a
long term yearly commitment made under the Obama administration.
Almost all of this was for military assistance. This was
part of an over all package of $38 billion in military aid over 2017 - 2028.

Over the years the US had helped Israel develop one of the most
advanced militaries in the world with the funds allowing them
to purchase sophisticated military equipment from the US.

There's more at:

http://bbc.com/news/57170576
Posted by Foxy, Friday, 30 September 2022 4:50:02 PM
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Dear Foxy,

With Israel's GDP of 520 Billion US dollars, 3.8 billions are a drop in the ocean.

Further, Israel cannot do whatever it likes with that money, but must use it to buy weapons from American companies. In a way, this is an internal American scheme to subsidize its own defense industry. Israeli officers admitted that at times they had to compromise on inferior weapons because their budget constrains forced them to purchase only American weapons.

Once that was important, but should American "aid" stop today (which I agree it should, with the money going to Ukraine instead), Israel would hardly feel it.
Posted by Yuyutsu, Friday, 30 September 2022 5:27:48 PM
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