Oops! After I posted yesterday I noticed a mistake in my calculations. I couldn't correct it till today due to the four comment limit.

The population has increased by about 30% not 70% in the last 25 years.

However, this doesn't negate my argument, because it's the increase in production that really matters. The GDP figure I gave is correct and the point that because it has grown exponentially the current working population contribute more to the wealth of society than the elderly did is still valid. The other important fact that is still valid is that most physical public or private assets (such as a road or a house) made decades ago would have deteriorated by now if they hadn't received regular maintenance/renovation/upgrades by the current working population.

So overall my case is still stands even though I gave the wrong population figure.

Dear mhaze,
You really do have to stop relying on thoroughly discredited pieces from old Quadrant editions as tenuous at best evidence for the made-up or overhyped rubbish you keep foisting upon us.

In the early 1940’s over 50% of the Australian workforce was unionised with Communists in many leadership positions.

There were disputes across all industries during the war but those at the docks pale into insignificance compared to the Hunter coal region. There miners went against their leadership and went of strike repeatedly for better conditions.

The Communist leadership of Australia’s unions stepped up, particularly when Curtin came to power in 1941, seeking to have members enlist. The leader of the Seamans Union E.V.Elliott, who was a leading member of the Communist Party, joined Curtin’s wartime Maritime Industry Commission which set out to ensure the smooth running of the sector.

What people like yourself seem quick to ignore is the hundreds of Merchant Navy workers who lost their lives operating mainly undefended civilian shipping around Australia’s coastlines during the war. These were members of the Communist led union so derided by the hard right of this country.

Perhaps at the next ANZAC parade some of your ilk at least acknowledge their contribution and sacrifice.

thinkabit,

Again, without diminishing your central point, there is a problem with your GDP numbers in that they are not adjusted for inflation. Therefore a lot of the increase you mention isn't because of increased productivity or production, nor is it reflective of improved living standards.

In fact, real GDP (ie GDP adjusted for the effects of inflation) increased by approximately 40% in the 25 yr period you're discussing. (I say approximately since the exact increase depends on the inflation rate you use).

SR,

Well since I didn't mention Quadrant as a source, (and by the way, it isn't) quite why you'd go there is a mystery. And since we were taking about the maritime unions and their efforts to sabotage Australian forces in the MENA regions, quite why you'd bring up the coal miners is a mystery.

Well actually its not a mystery. Its standard operating procedures for SR. When you can't argue with my points, change the subject and tell me how wrong I was about things I never mentioned. Dill.

But the funniest (or saddest) part of your post is that you start defending the maritime unions by referring to what they did after Hitler invaded Russia. That rather was my point which, if you look up, you'll see going over your head. While Hitler and Stalin were allies, the communist controlled maritime unions opposed the war and actively sought to sabotage the war effort. But once the nation to which their true allegiance lay (Russia) was threatened they were completely on board with the war and admonished the government for not doing more to help mother Russia. So rabbiting on about what the unions did after June 1941 misses the point. I was talking about what they did from Sept 39 to June 41.

Do try to keep up

Thinkabit,
The railway roadbeds are much the same as they were in the latter half of the 19C, likewise the basic structure of many roads.

Dear mhaze,

You are a riot son, I'll give you that.

No matter how often you repeat lines like these: "the communist controlled maritime unions opposed the war and actively sought to sabotage the war effort" they don't magically become evidence.

I quoted figures and used specific examples while all you have done is ponce on in running off Quadrant speaking points without anything to back them up.

What if anything do you have that will substantiate a single thing you have put in this thread?

SR,

Well again, I haven't mentioned Quadrant as a source. But don't let mere facts deter you...you never have before. You say "I quoted figures and used specific examples" and that's true. But they were facts and figures that weren't the slightest bit pertinent to what I said.

As to my knowledge on this, well its been known for many a decade. I first came across it from a series of articles in the National Times around 1980 or so. They were critiquing a sanitised history of the WWF. Then there is the more nuanced history written by Margo Beasley (?) in the 1990's. I'm not aware anything in Quadrant on the issue but if you have links, then show 'em. I'd be interested.

I fully understand that you and your ilk would want to rewrite history to hide what was a shameful period. But that rarely works. BTW are you disputing that the Australian communists were opposed to the war while Hitler and Stalin were allies?