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The Forum > General Discussion > Australian Choice

Australian Choice

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Dear Banjo,

«Bertrand Russell was simply expressing the opinion that most of our problems in this world are caused...»

Perhaps, but this was not what Foxy presented to me. She quoted him as saying: "The whole problem with the world is..."

«What about you, Yuyutsu ? What do you think ?

As could already be understood from my previous replies, I don't believe that the world has any problem.

I consider the world to be a school, where we receive whatever lessons are necessary for our growth, rather than as a goal unto itself where anything needs to be achieved.

The only "problem" is our ignorance with which we arrive in this school - that some of the lessons that we need in order to remove it feel difficult, is a necessity, not a problem.
Posted by Yuyutsu, Tuesday, 18 January 2022 10:25:30 AM
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Peter Fitzsimmons trying to wreck the country?

How so?

He's merely presented a model for a republic that he
and his team gleaned from questioning Australians in
what they wanted and were prepared to vote for. It's
not set in concrete and will probably be amended as
time passes. It's just a start.

As for him wanting to be the head of state?
I very much doubt that. And what's his bandana got to
do with anything? Lots of people wear head coverings
especially if they are self-conscious about their
hair loss - even women.

In any case it will be up to the Australian public to
decide on the type of society they want to live in and
who their head of state will be. We certainly can't do
worse than what we currently have.
Posted by Foxy, Tuesday, 18 January 2022 10:34:34 AM
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‘We certainly can’t do worse than what we currently have.”

We can’t get someone worse than the Queen?
Surely you jest?

One would hope so.
Posted by Is Mise, Tuesday, 18 January 2022 11:57:57 AM
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.

Dear Yuyutsu,

.

You wrote :

« She [Foxy] quoted him [Bertrand Russell] as saying : “The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves and wise people so full of doubts »

That’s correct, Yuyutsu. In fact, there are various versions of that saying by various authors, the better-known being : the Nobel Prize-winning Irish poet W. B. Yeats, the British philosopher Bertrand Russell, and the American writer Charles Bukowski.

The popular version is the one that Foxy indicated. Here is Bertrand Russell’s version :

« The fundamental cause of the trouble is that in the modern world the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt »

This can be found in his essay : “The Triumph of Stupidity”, which was one of a collection of essays he wrote, entitled : “Mortals and Others: Bertrand Russell's American Essays, 1931-1935.

Russell writes :

« What has been happening in Germany is a matter of the gravest portent for the whole civilised world. Throughout the last hundred and fifty years, individual Germans have done more to further civilisation than the individuals of any other country; during the latter half of this period, Germans, collectively, have been equally effective in degrading civilisation. At the present day the most distinguished names in the world of learning are still German; the most degraded and brutal government is also German. Of the individual Germans whose work has caused Germany to be respected, some are in exile, some in hiding, and some have disappeared, their fate unknown. Given a few years of Nazi rule, Germany will sink to the level of a horde of Goths.

What has happened is quite simple. Those elements of the population which are both brutal and stupid (and these two qualities usually go together) have combined against the rest. By murder, by torture, by imprisonment, by the terrorism of armed forces, they have subjected the intelligent and humane parts of the nation and seized power with the view of furthering the glory of the Fatherland.

.

‘Continued …)

.
Posted by Banjo Paterson, Wednesday, 19 January 2022 2:58:31 AM
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.

‘Continued …)

.

What has happened in Germany may well happen elsewhere. The British Fascists are not as yet a large party, but they are growing rapidly, and if at any future time there should be danger of a Labour Government that meant business, they would win the support of most of the governing classes. Meanwhile, the British government of India is a form of Fascism, all the worse for being alien. The British in India, like the Hitlerites in Germany, can only govern by putting the best people in prison.

Brute force plays a much larger part in the government of the world than it did before 1914, and what is especially alarming, force tends increasingly to fall into the hands of those who are enemies of civilisation. The danger is profound and terrible; it cannot be waved aside with easy optimism.

The fundamental cause of the trouble is that in the modern world the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt … »
.

« I consider the world to be a school, where we receive whatever lessons are necessary for our growth, rather than as a goal unto itself where anything needs to be achieved »
.

Well said, Yuyutsu. I agree : life apparently has no purpose – nor does nature, other than its own preservation, adaptation, evolution, and continuance.
.

« The only "problem" is our ignorance with which we arrive in this school - that some of the lessons that we need in order to remove it feel difficult, is a necessity, not a problem »
.

It’s not just a question of learning the lessons of life, Yuyutsu. Dictators like Stalin, Hitler, Mussolini, Franco, Mao, Pol Pot, Pinochet, and others all knew their lessons and the consequences of their acts. The crimes they committed against humanity were not due to ignorance.

Bertrand Russell’s explanation seems closer to the truth. Voltaire’s does too :

« Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities »

.
Posted by Banjo Paterson, Wednesday, 19 January 2022 3:02:27 AM
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Dear Banjo,

«Well said, Yuyutsu. I agree : life apparently has no purpose – nor does nature, other than its own preservation, adaptation, evolution, and continuance.»

You claim to agree, but that is not what I said.
What I said is that life HAS a purpose - to be a school.
The purpose of a school is not to preserve the school-building, nor to keep the students in forever. Individuals come and go, entering as children and coming out as adults.

«It’s not just a question of learning the lessons of life, Yuyutsu.»

Then you disagree, and that's fine, but please don't claim then that you agree with me.

«Dictators like Stalin, Hitler, Mussolini, Franco, Mao, Pol Pot, Pinochet, and others all knew their lessons and the consequences of their acts. The crimes they committed against humanity were not due to ignorance.»

They knew nothing. The crimes they committed were due to the deformities of their brains and certain external influences over these deformed brains.

From an objective point of view, Hitler and the others on your list were just blobs of flesh, blood, bones, fat, sinews and similar organic matter.
Same for Mother Teresa.
Same for Banjo Paterson (or whatever its real name is).

The ignorance I mentioned has nothing to do with the total unconsciousness of these bodies, but rather with the one(s) who in their ignorance, despite being conscious, consider themselves to be these bodies.
Posted by Yuyutsu, Wednesday, 19 January 2022 7:56:03 AM
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