Obviously if the vaccines don't work, there is no justification for vaccine policy.

But the world has gone so mad, that the fact they are ineffective and unsafe, is not taken to show that vaccine policy is unjustified! It should be abolished.

Anyway here's an interesting video at the individual level that I commend unto your worships' kind remarks herein.

And I, your humble coloqutor, will ever pray.

https://www.bitchute.com/video/QNXbgausdXfU/

Hi Cumberland,

As more and more people get the vaccine - and there
are no serious side effects - this will all pass, and
we shall look back on all this uncertainty in later
years and wonder what all the fuss was all about.

The efficacy of medical vaccines is well above my pay grade. Unless you can personally do something to make things the way you want them, you are wasting your time belly aching about it. The politicians and health poohbahs are not listening to you.

I have had my first jab. No side effects - just most other people. If you don't believe in it, don't want it, don't have and shut TFU.

Our neighbours have all had the jab.
No side affects either.
No problems.

Foxy

Did you watch the video? You're talking as if you didn't see it.

Did you see the child in the video?

How can you say there are no side-effects or that it's safe?

You just ignore all the deaths, the paralysis, the strokes, the 15 year old dying from a heart attack, and so on, and declare it safe?

How do you solve the knowledge problem involved?

Seriously?

ttbn

You do realise that they're intending to make it a condition of being able to leave Australia, even if you're healthy?

How can you treat it, as if it's a purely voluntary question? You're missing the point.

Can't you see the issues involved?

How can you presume to judge, on behalf of those who are dying from it - way out of proportion to anything that would be allowed under ordinary law - that their deaths are justified for the greater good

Hi Cumberland,

No I didn't see the vidoe. I couldn't access it
Perhaps if you left off the "s" in http. It might
help.

In any case I am fully aware of all the risks involved
and I have mentioned side effects in this discussion.
However, how do the statistics compare with the number
of people who've had no side effects after the jab?
How many have side-effects and are they really related
to the vaccine or to pre-existing conditions?

Besides the vaccine is not mandatory. People do have a
choice. Also your attacking people who don't agree
with you does not help this debate.

I've had the first jab. I was really crook for the subsequent 24 hrs with a headache that would kill a brown dog. Somewhat less sick the next day. Thereafter fine though not 100%. Two weeks later - all good.

Remember when we had to close down society because even one death was too many.
Now the same people who bought that want to tell us that we have to weigh risks and that if a few die, well so be it.

What changed? Well the government messaging changed and the sheeple fell into line. As usual.

Cumberland,

I've tried to reconcile your response with what I said, to no avail.

I said that: I know nothing about the vaccine,
that unless you have control over a situation, there is no point
in worrying about it,
that nobody who can do anything is going to listen to you,
that I have no side effects from the vaccine,
and that vaccination is not compulsory. I was a bit rude at the
end. Sorry.

You came back with they are INTENDING to make vaccination a requirement for leaving the country. Are they? Will they? If they do, so what? Most people cannot get permission to leave the country now. If you could leave, wouldn't you want some protection from the virus?

You say that I'm missing the point, and don't get the issues involved. What point? What issues?

You also seem to be saying that I presume to judge". What am I judging?

Your last paragraph is a dog's breakfast. Didn't you say that you are a human rights lawyer?

I respect your right to have your views, but you haven't backed them up coherently

"I have had my first jab. No side effects - just most other people. If you don't believe in it, don't want it, don't have and shut TFU."

Yeah that's reasonable approach I suppose, each to their own
I wonder how it's all going to play out
- 'the vaccinated' v's 'the unvaccinated'?
- Passports for these experimental vaccines and such;
- Unvaccinated people being prevented from taking part in society?

Beyond this, when they talk out 'vaccines spreading like viruses' and;
'Vaccinated people causing unvaccinated pregnant women to spontaneously abort'

Then I truly am concerned that human beings aren't about to screw things up really badly here.
- Seems like there's good potential.
What if these vaccines and the menstrual problems and miscarriages reportedly associated with it ends up making the human race sterile?
If I have an open mind I've got to accept that anything is possible

Its not as though many elites don't openly advocate for population reduction and saying humans are an invasive species and that.

I don't know where we're headed or how it's all going to turn out.
- But I don't really feel optimistic about any of it, honestly.

This is my individual view:

To those out there questioning the vaccines, think of the following:

1. If you mop the floor in your bathroom you may slip over.
2. If you go outside you may trip over and hurt yourself.
3. If you cross a road, you may get hit by a bus.
4. If you eat out at a restaurant, you may get food poisoning.
5. If you use a knife in the kitchen, you may cut your finger.
6. If you eat something for dinner, you might choke on some food.
7. If you drive in your car, you may die in a car accident.

Now, to all of you so "concerned" about getting a vaccination, I hope you live a very sheltered life, so nothing bad ever happens to you!

Hi Foxy,

Don't bother with the video, it has nothing to do with Covid-19. Some unidentified anti-vaxxer going on about child immunisation for 7 minutes. The outlandish claims, were all based on a perfectly normal looking child he held in his arms for about the first 30 seconds of the clip. Claims like there's no Polio in the community so why have your child vaccinated with poison. Well, yeah, there's no Polio in the community, maybe that's because children are vaccinated. The conspiracy theory got a run of course, they vaccinate your children so they will get sick and keep coming back, typical of the far right and their conspiracy theories. I'd suggest the bloke giving the interview takes a dose of his activated charcoal and a dose of his castor oil. Was he an MD, not sure, didn't say he was, if so giving medical advice without a consultation, extremely dangerous!

All this from the BitChute web site;

"BitChute is a video hosting service known for accommodating far-right individuals and conspiracy theorists, and for hosting hateful content." Wikipedia

That's totally retarded NathanJ.
- It's really poor leap of logic.

So you're saying because I risk I hurting myself when I mop the bathroom floor;
Because I risk tripping over and hurting myself if I go outside
Because I risk getting hit by a bus if I cross the road
Because I might get food poisoning if I eat at a restaurant
Because I might cut myself if I use a knife in the kitchen
Or because I might choke on my food when I eat
or that when I drive I may be involved in an accident.

Because all of those things can happen;
- That I should be ok with injecting into my bloodstream whatever poison these pharmaceutical companies have skipped regular trials for?

Lets say I mix up some roundup and call it a 'vaccine'
I'll throw in some blood thinning agent so womens periods last 3 months and their babies abort...
Hell I'll even throw in some of that aborted baby fetus too.
I'll add the virus, with the aids spike proteins so that after you have vaccine, you'll test positive for the virus.

We wont bother keeping proper records of all the adverse reactions or tell people the truth, because we've all got to push this lie that its 'in the greater good'.

I mean after all that in itself should be enough.
We've already outlawed as heretics anyone who doesn't support any official narrative, be that supportive of gays, multiculturalism, critical race theory, climate change, kids having sex changes at age 12 and stuff, transgender toilets, Islamic extremism, etc etc.
people are already too scared of being labelled a bigot to question anything, so there shouldn't be a problem.

We'll frighten people that they can't take part in society if they don't take our 'untested and ill-reported special hybrid roundup concoction'.

[Cont.]
Tell me if this shite was so good, and so fundamental to moving forward, then why didn't all the pharmaceutical companies work together to create one actual good vaccine?

No, they want me to stick something into my bloodsteam like I'm choosing McDonalds, Hungry Jacks or KFC, and they're all poison, and probably should be labelled so.

Whats all this stuff about 'If a vaccinated person comes into contact with an an unvaccinated person they spontaneously abort, miscarry or have kid with cognitive difficulties?'

What about the increases in cancers and autism?
You people are just going to add to an already screwed up industry that has little idea of what it's really doing.

What happens if you kill my mum, or my wifes unborn child?
How do you think I'm going to feel about all you people when my wifes vagina bleeds for 3 months non stop because of this freaking poison you're all ignorantly in love with

If you want to go shoot yourself up with aborted baby fetuses and aids spike proteins be my guest, but don't judge others for choosing not to.

SkyNews reports that the US State Department has documents revealing that Chinese military scientists discussed the weaponisation of SARS coronaviruses 5 years before the Covid pandemic. The Chinese outlined their ideas that WW3 would be fought with biological weapons.

Also on SkyNews, a blaring headline, "Australian dies in India of unknown causes". The misleading piece of shite-stirring goes on to say that the person was a permanent resident - not an Australian at all.

The media has periodically listed some of the businesses and individuals with increasing profits and and bank balances due to the China virus. A UNSW academic and economist, Gigi Foster, has raised this rather ugly and self-serving reason for the non-stop covid haranguing and scaremongering by vested interests to keep the pandemic front and centre.

These people are “keeping the madness going for as long as possible”. The virus has been a real snouts-in-the trough opportunity. Many businesses and individuals are making a motza out of good old Covid 19. Fear and hysteria is being used to keep the big bucks rolling in.

"...was a permanent resident - not an Australian at all."

Very accurate piece of hair-splitting!!

Armchair Critic,

<<That I should be ok with injecting into my bloodstream whatever poison these pharmaceutical companies have skipped regular trials for >>

Do you read all of the numbers on the back of products when you go shopping? You might have an allergic reaction to one of those poisonous additives.

http://theconversation.com/explainer-what-are-e-numbers-and-should-you-avoid-them-in-your-diet-43908#:~:text=In%20Australia%2C%20it%20can%20be%20found%20on%20labels,colour%20164%E2%80%9D%20in%20Australia%20%28or%20E164%20in%20Europe%29.

For example one part of the article says: "Everything is toxic in a high enough dose. Even caffeine is toxic if you have enough of it."

Personally re food additives and getting allergic reactions to these, I doubt though you're even going to care. If you eat 100% certified organic food or go vegetarian you might have a better chance of avoiding all of these additives, but most in Australia don't live that way.

Finally an Australian man has died in India after contracting COVID-19, authorities have confirmed. Taking a vaccination here is a public interest issue and the more that can be done to kill off COVID-19 the better!

The question is not whether the vaccine is a uni-dimensional good.

For starters, it's not a vaccine, okay? It's an irreversible permanent genetic modification, that has not been approved by ordinary law, but only on an emergency basis, even though safer and more effective treatments are available, without paying zillions for IP rights to Pharma. The clinical trials are not due to finish for at least another year. The animal trials were skipped, and previously were discontinued because they killed so many animals. It is causing deaths, strokes, heart-attacks, and many other injuries to people who took it - any other medicine would have been banned at this stage. Informed consent is missing. The jabs do not stop you getting the virus, the disease, or transmitting it.

Gross mortality figures *have not significantly changed* in the last 5 years, which means THERE IS NO PANDEMIC.

Listen. Since 300,000 people have supposedly died of covid in the USA, why isn't there an extra 300,000 deaths on top of the usual 3 million deaths per year?

Because, since the PCR tests cannot distinguish between covid and a pawpaw, a pheasant, dog urine, or Coca-Cola, THEY CAN'T DISTINGUISH BETWEEN INFLUENZA A AND B, AND COVID.

Okay? Got that?

And flu has magically disappeared!

The CDC has stated that only 7% of the deaths that it previously said were from Covid, were actually of Covid alone. The other 97%, the people are dying of co-morbidities - pneumonia, heart attack, HBP, diabetes, and flu.

Okay?

So even if the taking of vaccines is volunteered, and without any coercion - which they aren't - they still wouldn't have informed consent, and thus breach the Nuremberg principles for which doctors hanged.

And even if people gave informed consent, they can't consent for others whom they infect and who suffer injuries and wrongs, including the deaths of unborn children.

Now. Can you see in all these facts, any implication for the ASSUMPTION that there is no question that the imposition of vaccines is automatically justified because muh covid??

Sheesh! What is wrong with you people?

Is Mise,

Fact, not hairsplitting. Once you get permanent residence, you've got it made: don't have to call yourself Australian, don't even have to speak English. And you can toddle of back home anytime and stay as long as you like - always expecting to have the same privileges as native born and naturalised Australians - and whine and call everyone a racists when it doesn't work out that way.

Cumberland,

No answers to my questions about your accusations directed at me. What a surprise. Rather than your 'sheeshing' about what is wrong with other people, you should consult a professional to find out what is wrong with you.

As the world responds to the COVID-19 pandemic, we face the challenge of an overabundance of information related to the virus. Some of this information may be false and potentially harmful.

Inaccurate information spreads widely and at speed, making it more difficult for the public to identify verified facts and advice from trusted sources, such as their local health authority or WHO.

However, everyone can help to stop the spread. If you see content online that you believe to be false or misleading, you can report it to the hosting social media platform.

World Health Organisation.

Yes Paul, & now we actually know that what ever these concoctions are, they are not vaccines in the tradition of vaccines.

They do not prevent people from catching the virus, although they still claim to reduce the severity of the infection, if you have survived the vaccine itself.

They do not prevent you transmitting the to other folk, so can not in any way promote herd immunity.

So what the hell do they really do, & why are we wasting so much public money on the garbage?

Fool governments signed up sight unseen for these things probably to be seen to be doing "SOMETHING". They, & the taxpayer, have been totally ripped off just as a fool buying a used car sight unseen would be.

Foxy and Ttbn

Okay, sorry.

Foxy, did you know that:
1. they have never tried an mRNA treatment on humans before?
2. the animals trials were discontinued because all the animals died within 2 years, when they trialled mRNA for SARS? Pfizer's ex-Vice President, a senior scientist in all kinds of vaccines, said he thinks anyone taking it will be dead in 3 years?
3. they skipped the animal trials for this jab, which means, you are the guinea pig?
4. it has the highest rate of adverse events of any vaccine in history?

If they didn't informed you, that means they are guilty of breaching the Nuremberg principles, which means it's a crime against humanity as defined by law.

Did you know that when you got the jab?

Ttbn
"What point? What issues?"

The point and issues, that it is not good enough to say, it's voluntary, and if you want, take it, and if you don't, don't.

I think there are a number of issues.

IF the jab did not present a risk to others of having a non-consensual permanent modification of their genome with insertions of nanotechnology, THEN the consent of the patient would answer all questions of morality. But that's not the case: Pfizer.

Even if one consents, that does not justify covid policy.

I have mentioned the other issues:
it's not a vaccine
it's a medical experiment
it doesn't stop you getting the virus, getting sick or transmitting it
the lockdowns have no scientific basis
most of those getting sick with it are 'high-calorie malnourished'; while the safe and effective treatments include cheap, generic, drugs and 'nurtaceutials'.
people are not being told that it has not been approved by the FDA, that the clinical trials have not been done, that the patient is the guinea pig in a medical experiment, that the process usually take 10 to 15 years to make sure it's safe, that the animal trials in the last mRNA attempt ended with all the animals dying within 2 years, that it has the highest rate of adverse events of any vaccine in history, that it causes death, abortions, and injury that medical experts all over the world are warning against it and being censored, that safer, more effective, cheaper and healthier alternatives exist, and that the WHO is politicised, and has consistently called it wrong or without scientific basis over and over again.
it is being coerced by threats against our rights and liberties including travel, employment, business, being able to mix in socialise, and so on
that the scientific basis of covid policy is lacking and in contention, and has never been demonstrated, including masking, lockdowns and "vaccines".

Therefore it is not a sufficient answer to these facts, to say, in effect, if you don't want it, don't have it.

My last paragraph assumed you were suggesting a greater good argument justifies covid policy, which has Nuremberg problems.

Paul1405
That would have to be about the dumbest comment I've ever seen anyone make on the internet.

Cumberland,

"The point and issues, that it is not good enough to say, it's voluntary, and if you want, take it, and if you don't, don't."

Why isn't it good enough to say it's voluntary? Just because you say so? You need a reason for saying that what I say is wrong. You don't seem to be able to do that.

This time it is your penultimate paragraph that makes no sense.

And, your last one confuses consent (to vaccination, supposedly) with "covid policy". These are two different matters. I believe that the government has made a total dog's breakfast when it comes to policy.

I think that you are just repeating what you have seen or heard from an obsessive, conspiratorial nutjob. I've always been critical of both the federal government and the state governments. I also believe that it is mainly sheer luck, not lockdowns and other assaults on our freedoms that have seen us fare better than most other countries. You only need to look at Victoria to see how stupid lockdowns are - 800 deaths with less than 50 in the rest of the country. But, I have to say that I think you have gone way over the top, and have made some very unnecessarily wild statements that no reasonable person could agree with.

Cumberland,

You have made the claim that; "Pfizer's ex-Vice President, a senior scientist in all kinds of vaccines, said he thinks anyone taking it will be dead in 3 years?" I presume you are referring to something Michael Yeadon has said. Please provide evidence of that fact, otherwise it is incumbent on the FORUM ADMINISTRATOR Graham Young to remove this and other erroneous comments you and others are making about Covid-19 vaccines.

This Michael Yeadon has become some kind of folk hero of the ultra right. Along with others he made without evidence, the oft repeated, outlandish claim that Covid-19 vaccine given to women could cause infertility and pregnancy problems. I have a young pregnant niece in Sydney, now worried about her unborn child. I advised her NOT TO HAVE THE VACCINATION, not because i think the vaccine will do her or her unborn child harm, but because of people like you spreading false rumour is causing her undue worry and stress that could affect her and her unborn child.

Graham,

I hope you read this comment, and respond accordingly, I can see the "3 years dead comment" causing great distress to some posters, particularly Foxy who has had health issues recently, and has already had the jab.

"For starters, it's not a vaccine, okay? It's an irreversible permanent genetic modification, that has not been approved by ordinary law, but only on an emergency basis, even though safer and more effective treatments are available, without paying zillions for IP rights to Pharma."

- He's right you know.

What I'd like to do here is present a 'Sheep Test'.

Now I showed you a video where it was reported that vaccinated people can inadvertently cause the miscarriages of unvaccinated women.
Those supposedly comes from Pfizer's own documents.

If you all want I'll email Mike and ask him where the info he reported came from?

Until then right what I want to know is how many people here knowing that taking the vaccine could potentially kill your neighbours unborn child, are willing to ignorantly sweep that aside like an unsubstantiated rumour, and with full faith in the vaccine and pharmaceutical companies that made them as well as blinkers on to any possible adverse reaction;
- Will go ahead and get the jab anyway?

How many of you have so much faith in this, that you'd be willing to sweep any warning info aside, and blindly risk killing your neighbours unborn kids anyway?

Sheep Test

http://youtu.be/__Vd1i10FqU

"What do you want?"

Sheep - "Vaccines"

"When do you want it?"

Sheep - "Now!"

Morrison is reported today as saying that our international borders will remain closed indefinitely. He is still thinking in terms of zero cases, and he doesn't believe a total roll-out of the vaccine will make any difference.

Isn't this the same PM who told state premiers that they can't keep closing their borders? And how do closed borders fit with allowing possibly diseased Indians to pour into Australia on the 15th. of this month? And what about the breathless daily reporting of another case of covid brought to us by another "man from overseas"?

Perhaps he is waiting for a miracle to give us our lives back. But, what's the point? By the time we stop breathing to fulfill his zero carbon dioxide madness, there will be no plant life left, and no people to need it.

Anthony Albanese is the only thing keeping this man in his position. No vote for the Coalition until he has gone.

The PM has been described as having made himself a political prisoner to panicky WA and Qld premiers, and in doing so, has made all of us prisoners to his re-election hopes. He is pressing the panic button button hard to stay in power.

The Prime Minister has sought to re-assure Australians
that any desire to life restrictions would not be taken
lightly.
"There are 3 million people now who have died from
COVID . The COVID pandemic is raging around the world.
I assure Australians that I will not be putting at risk
the way we are living which is so different to the rest
of the world today."

However, the PM also said that small steps will be taken
to ease restrictions and they will be done very, very,
carefully and must be done in partnership with the
states and territories in terms of how the
quarantine program works.

It appears to be a very responsible way that the matter is
being handled by our government.

Paul

Everything you say is false and distressing, so should be censored, right?

You're only begging the knowledge question.

The information is in the public domain. LOOK IT UP! Use your brain!

Your absurd idea that the knowledge problem can be solved by reposing blind docile credulity in the WHO, and everything else should be banned, is so dumb it's dangerous. Real fascist stuff!

There are real issues here that can't be solved by going in a circle, and you need to engage in rational discourse.

You don't get to decide on behalf of evryone else on the basis that you know everything, as proved by regurgitating what you got from official propganda, and try to silence dissent disproving you.

ttbn
I have given such reasons.
1. it spreads to, and injures, non-consenting persons
2. informed consent lacking
3. conditioned on threats to human rights such as freedom of movement and association
Plus all policy violates consent.

It's no use attacking me personally. The real issues remain.

So by squarking "conspiratorial", you admit that, if the allegations are factually correct, you lose the argument, yes? Yes, correct, that's what you're saying by this shallow question-begging?

When the first ever vaccines were rolled out in the late 18th century there was a ground-swell of opposition. That first vaccine was against small pox and was developed from cows suffering cow pox. (The very word vaccine derives from the Latin word vaccinae meaning cow).

There were claims at the outset that injecting people with bits of bovine would cause them to grow horns or develop other cow-like features.

Reading people like Armchair and Cumberland demonstrates that we, as a race, haven't, in many ways, progressed much in the past coupla centuries.

Morrison will sell his soul to keep the job - easy, as he has no values or ideology - and at the moment most Australians want big government to protect them, and that's what he is going to swing with. He us a shocking opportunist.

The Prime Minister is following medical advice.
He warns that Australia is in "no hurry" to
fully reopen its international borders. However
he is flagging a gradual process starting with
"essential travel."

He has raised the prospect of allowing Australians
to travel overseas and return home without going
into hotel quarantine if they were vaccinated
against COVID-19.

However, he warned that the vaccination program was
not a "silver bullet," and the nation would need to
prepare for at least 1,000 coronavirus cases a week
if restrictions were widely lifted.

He reassured Australians that any decision to lift
restrictions would not be taken lightly. It would be
a gradual process.

Which makes it a medical decision - not a political one.
Done in the interests of the country.

Foxy,

Come on. Even you cannot be that naive.

Ttbn

Yes, and they know that the lies they tell don't have to be true. They just have to persuade the brainwashed gullible moron part of the population. Even if that's only 51 percent, they think flagrant lying is justified, which is what's happening now. These bleating sheep refuse to think for themselves.

None of the assumptions of policy have been debated in an orderly way in which the arguments for and against every tenet of covid policy has been subjetece to dispassionate analysis, and evidence and reason for and against.

Instead what we have is the mere assumption of power by the state, backed up by double-standards, self-contradiction, legal corruption, censoring and coercion at every turn.

While you may have taken it voluntarily, the actions of the state have comprehensively breached the requirement of informed consent, and accountability, many times over.

All
"It's easier to fool a man than to convince him he's been fooled."
Mart Twain

The approach to the knowledge problem that Foxy, Paul1405, and all the other totalitarian fasicsts, take, is simplicity itself:

1. "It must be so, because the government tells me so."
2. If not, see step 1.

And that's it. Round and round they go, endlessly assuming that the government simplly knows everything, and any question is ridiculous, and this confers on them a right to unlimited arbtirary power and arrogance, even though kings and the officers of state have been put to death for what these useful idiots are promoting.

Foxy

If you want me to swallow down your unidentified, and unarticulated assumption that the government is all-caring, all-knowing, and all-efficient, and that a fact and value are whatever the government says they are, the answer is: "no", because that assumption has no basis in reality or reason.

The fact that it's a medical problem, doesn't mean it's not a political problem, and does not dispose of all issues of medical fact, law or the constitution. You're talking nonsense.

History exists. You need to understand that this has consequences. We're not just floating in a disconnected bubble.

I've already told you that it is in breach of the Nuremberg principles on medical experimentation, requriging informed consent - the foundation of the pharmaceutical industry - and here you just want to garble-yarp away as if you've never heard it. Wake up!

For one small example, any governnent officer has a duty to consider whether to invade any common law right. This means, if they fail to consider both sides of the question, in writing, one has an action administrative order, (a stop order, a 'doi it' order, or a 'lemme decide that' order by a court or tribunal).

These orders don't pay money damages compensation. But with high numbers of deaths and injuries, there will be a huge common interest in lawsuits against the state, including personal injury, wrongful death, negligence, failure to perform a statutory duty as required, as well a criminal and constitutional actions.

To get money damages, you have to have a case in tort, i.e. a civil wrong, for example negligence, nuisance, trespass, and other torts. In a sub-set of these, a group action would lie for money compensation against executive officers.

The politicians can waive liability on behalf of pharma, but they cannot waive it on behalf of the executive arm of government, which remains liable in administrative law, tort law, contract law, criminal law and constitutional law.

See? It's not decided by Foxy, an anonymous self-opinionated nobody on the internet, brain-farting her personal opinion that it's "medical, not political".

Anyway, what about the Nuremberg trials of the Nazi doctors, which you defend?

Were they "medical not political"? You don't even understand what you're talking about.

You need to *think*.

For all those who think vaccination is of no value need to take one look at both India and Brazil in their present crises, being two countries unsuccessful as yet with their vaccination programs. Compare India and Brazil with the United States and UK and the invidious position both were in pre vaccination roll out and look at the success they now enjoy due to the vaccines.

Hark at the inconsistency and opportunism of the man who is fast becoming our worst PM ever:

1 May 2020:

"I think it's important we all hold our nerve. We need to restart the economy. You can't stay under the doona forever."

9 May 2021:

"I don’t see an appetite for (reopening international borders) at the moment…we sit here as an island that’s living like few countries in the world are at the moment. We have to be careful not to exchange that way of life for what everyone else has."000
Terry Barnes reckons Australia is like 'Brigadoon', which some of you might remember as a musical, then a film.

ttbn and Cumberland,

I don't know what else the PM and our government can
do under the circumstances that they are faced with.
They have to listen to medical advice and act appropriately.
Our country - all things considered - has done remarkably well
compared to other countries around the world during this
pandemic. We are lucky that we're living here and not elsewhere.

Mr. 'I-will-do-and-say-anything-to-keep-the-job' is hiding behind, and listening to, what one commentator described as 'rent a quote "medical experts"', and 'social media fear-dwellers'.

ttbn,

What would you have the PM and the government do?
Who should they listen to if not medical experts?

Our Federation is shot. State premiers are running the show, and the PM is hiding behind the national, so-called, ‘cabinet’. The media is squeezing every bit of scaremongering it can out of the virus, with sessions and ‘spots’ dedicated to the China virus; someone comes in from overseas, tests positive (allegedly) and the first 10 minutes of the TV news is given over to it, along with anything they can find about cases and or deaths in Timbuktu.

Politicians either don’t know what they are doing or, they do know, and they are preparing us for the loss of more freedoms in the future. And, all the while, they are convincing poor, dumb fools that the are protecting them.

The sad part is that the fear mongering is working for them, with tinpot dictators like McGowan and Palaszcuk returned to power. Now the PM is aping them - he really wants to “help” us with vaccine ‘passports’.

‘Show us your papers’ will be heard in the streets - if we are still speaking English, that is.

Foxy,

A second opinion is always handy. There are eminent scientists, with actual qualifications and experience, who have very different views from Morrison's public servant "experts" whom, I understand are not virologists but are ... well, box wallahs, not good enough for private practice or research.

I don't understand why you ask questions of me when you know my answers will make no difference to what you think. And, I am not criticising your opinions: I'm criticising our appalling PM. I really don't see why you or anyone else needs to defend a politician.