More from Shellenberger for fantasists to explore and sharpen refututations. http://www.forbes.com/search/?q=shellenberger#40b34a08279f

Something for Alan B. http://tinyurl.com/y3bwsp9l

What is the official definition when rating renewable energy sources
such as wind turbines for output ?
When we see it stated by the media, proponents or opposers we all need
to use the same definitions.
I hear such statements as a 500 Megawatt wind farm.
Exactly what does that mean ?
Unless we know what the definitions for wind and solar mean then we
are arguing without meaning.

Dear Lucifrase,

You wrote;

"Steelie, what form of argument is this, putting the SMS on par with the 100% renewables fantasy and lumping critics with some confected connection?"

My point was clearly made so if you have trouble understanding it I invite you to read it again.

We should note that Snowy Hydro has gas and diesel assets to cope with intermittent production pauses. I'm sure if the scheme was put up now as a way of mitigating carbon pollution regardless of the economics you would be railing against it like you constantly do wind and solar projects.

Your ideology repeatedly trumps your logic constantly.

We still have not heard how farm machinery, trains, trucks, overseas freight, and cruise ships are to be fuelled. It appears they haven't got a clue how to fuel these without producing CO2.

If the Greens had their way farming would cease, cows and humans murdered to reduce population, there would be no planes or ships of heavy road transport creating tourism or transporting food or goods. they are the proponents of a cult of death to the economy of a nation and its people.

Well Josephus, if 45% reduction is to be achieved then all sources
must be reduced by that amount unless some other source can be removed
totally. No one seems to be able to discuss this point.
I have asked elsewhere but I never get answers.
Not even to tell me that my question is meaningless.
I notice even Craig Kelly does not get answers. If an MHR cannot get
answers who can ?

We will probably have to cull 45% of the Australian population, and
if so I think it could be done as people exit the polling booths.
Ask them how they voted and if they voted Labour shoot them.
Problem solved.