To Yuyutsu.

I do mind the hatred. It's a horrible thing. But it was there before I arrived, and I doubt it will leave due to my silence. The best we can do is correct people when they are wrong. No one like to be corrected, but if they aren't corrected, what they say is unrestrained by the truth and hatred spreads to others quicker.

This is one reason why I don't like your approach that all paths are equal. Because they really aren't. Some are wrong through lies or misunderstanding, other paths are wrong because they are harmful to the person or those they are around. Holding to the standard once you find it is a good thing. Testing the standard to see if it is still good is also a good thing but only if you can test it and measure the results. Often people will only toss doubt around because it stumps people and it can't be tested to see if the doubt holds merit.

Look at a construction crew. They have a design and a plan. Whether it is building construction, road construction, bridges, or just remodeling any of it. If the construction company holds to good standards then it shows through their work. If they don't hold to good standards, then what they build falls apart. Having a standard and standing by it is not a bad attribute. Often we should text what we can. When we do, if the standard is right, then the most it'll do is correct us to not rely on it. Like we often do when taking shortcuts in both work and safety.

Dear Not_Now.Soon,

Enough.

david f writes: “I think their answers are better than the Christian sickness of wallowing in guilt and hoping some magic belief will take away our sins.”

Yes, the Christian god actually shows all the signs of an abusive husband: Controlling, Jealous, possessive, misogynistic, mood swings, bad temper, threats of violence, emotional abuse, victim blaming, hypocritical, and holds unrealistic expectations.

Worse still, many Christians show signs of being in the first two stages of Battered Woman Syndrome:

1. Denying that they are being abused;
2. Believing that they are the cause of the abuse.

Religion convinces people that they’re sick and then dangles a useless remedy in their face.

--

Yuyutsu,

There is no objective understanding of what religion is all about.

<<… due to evangelical attitudes like yours, other people get to hate religion, as well as completely misunderstand what it is all about …>>

It is arrogant of you to assume that your understanding is objectively the right one.

--

Not_Now.Soon,

That there are places and events in the Bible confirmed by archaeological findings is hardly surprising.

<<Archeological studies continue to find support to foundations of the stories within the bible. Small things like the accuracy of cities, rulers, and events lead to supporting the the main.>>

However, none of the findings support the reports of Jesus’ alleged divinity or miracles and it is these that are central to the theology, not mundane details like events and places.

New York City exists, but that doesn’t mean Spiderman is real.

<<God really is real.>>

You have not yet demonstrated this. To assert as fact that which is not evidently true is dishonest.

<<… video games can be counted as rotting the mind.>>

On the contrary, video games have been shown to have many positive effects on cognition and brain function and brain structure.

Given the levels of anti-science sentiment and sycophantic behaviour among so many Christians, I think we can safely say that it rots the mind. What's more is that it appears the more metaphorically one interprets Scripture, the less they show signs of the rot.

//If I have done anything that counts as evil. Point it out. I count evil as truely wrong. Not something relative to a person, where one's morals say one thing and another's says something different.//

Hmm, that isn't bad advice. So go ahead, make my day... tell me where not believing in your god has led me to commit evil, something that is truly wrong. Not something relative to a person, where one's religious beliefs say one thing and another's says something different.

Actual, proper, genuine evil.... nope, you can't, can you? So I guess following a different god doesn't make me so wicked after all, eh?

//The claim to being evil likewise should not be used just to make a point.//

Amen, brother.

//To Toni Lavis. Always an accuser, and always ready to drag someone through the mud.//

To NNS. Always thin-skinned, and mis-interpreting criticisms of his arguments as personal attacks.

Well gosh, that was a productive use of words. [sarcasm]

//If a person is on drugs, and their addiction brings them harm or brings them to harm others then that person needs help. Regardless if they want it or not.//

No, I quite clearly specified people who neither require nor desire help. Go back and read what I said. Drug addicts do not belong to that set. For the most part, whilst in the grip of their addiction, they never desire help - just the next high. Obviously they require help, because they're poisoning themselves and they typically lack the capacity to help themselves.

People who are not Christian are not drug addicts. They are not like drug addicts. They are not people who really do require help, but their brains are too cooked to realise it. They are sane, healthy, intelligent, educated people with agency and their own individual personality, and I don't see that they need anything that can only be provided by Christianity, and by Christianity alone. Sometimes, if you're lucky, they might be desire to be helped by Christianity. When that happens, you should be thankful and joyous. But you've done naught to demonstrate that anybody requires Christianity any more than they require Taoism.

//It is our weaknesses that restrain us from doing worse then we already do.//

Because we're all just a radioactive spider bite or gamma ray irradiation away from becoming a supervillain? Screw that... with great power comes a great opportunity to play the role of a trickster god, neither hero nor villain. Think Q out of Star Trek, although the basic idea is much older than that.

You really like to see the worst in people, don't you? Why so negative, dude?

//You need Jesus, and you need God, because you are sinful. Not because you aren't a Christian.//

Right, so I don't need Christianity {P} because I'm not a Christian . But I still need it {NOT P} because I'm sinful, and Christianity is the only possible remedy for that sin.

So basically, your argument is {P} & {NOT P}. If you can't see the problem there.....

//Archeological studies continue to find support to foundations of the stories within the bible.//

But you can't trust them buggers, can you? The archaeologists, I mean. They keep coming up with artifacts and remains and stuff that they claim to be older than the beginning of the universe in circa 6,000 BC. Nah, you can't trust archaeologists NNS... they just make it all up.

//TV, movies and video games can be counted as rotting the mind.//

Yeah, I guess... if you're about 90.

It's not a new complaint, this notion that new forms of entertainment atrophy the brain. When novels were still novel, many a staunch old conservative could be heard remarking on the dreadful effects these novels would have on the brain. These days, staunch old conservatives complain that the young people don't read enough (hell, I complain that the young people don't read enough and I'm a long way from 90). I wonder if in 50 years time I'll be sitting around griping that the young people don't watch enough TV these days.

TV has broadened my mind immensely. It's not all FOX News and Dr. Phil; there are hell of a lot of extremely informative and entertaining programs out there. The name 'David Attenborough' springs to mind, but that's just the tip of the iceberg. I have a great interest in British history, but it was not a topic covered well in Australian schools, so I distilled most of my knowledge from watching BBC documentaries. You can learn a lot from the idiot box, but only if you watch the right shows. Here's one to get you started:

http://iview.abc.net.au/programs/brian-cox-life-of-a-universe/SC1600H003S00

//Not all religions are on the same footing. Unfortunately it's not that easy because as this conversation is showing, many people don't even acknowledge God//

Or at least, they don't acknowledge your god as their god. Obstinate buggers, aren't they? It's almost as if they were perfectly happy and content with their own beliefs, and just can't understand why you think adopting your beliefs would make them happier, more ethical, or just better people in general.