"another sad example was the singer Pete Seeger of 'Peter, Paul and Mary fame', who released an album in 1940 demanding that the US stay out of the war, stop supporting Britain and calling Roosevelt a war-monger for helping the enemy ie Britain."

mhaze are you willing to say the same about Charles Lindbergh? Probably the most famous anti war American of the time. Do you have anything to say about the very vocal Conservative Coalition in the US which strong opposed war with Germany and Japan. It literally evaporated, December 7th 1941.

It's OK guys I've got this one. I am asked 'what benefits would we be enjoying with a Hitler flunky running Australia'?

Well where to begin. For starters we would be one of the most successful countries in the world. I take my cues from Germany. We would be more disciplined.

I don't think I need say anything more than; look at Germany and Japan today. Sure the allies had a lot to do with their start-up but boy did they take off.

We can imagine that the Japanese and German work ethic and our resources we would have exceeded both these countries in all the things we strive for in lifestyle and personal wealth.

Unions as we know them today would not exist. We would be a very prosperous country, again like Japan and Germany, only wealthier.

We would not fear for our lives in our own homes and more so if we ventured in certain 'no go' areas.

We would have been so far more advanced technologically. Our manufacturing would have been of 'worlds best practices' standards, and not some sick joke we keep telling ourselves that we are.

We would have still been making the most technologically advanced cars in the world. Instead we couldn't even sustain merely assembling what was originally a German car.

The Holden Commodore, it was actually a German OPEL, just re-badjed, and as usual, we called it our Aussie car. HAH! yeh, getting it now?

The answer to your question is right in front of your nose and has been since the end of the war, you know this, and yet you keep up this pathetic attempt to point score just to not have to admit your wrong.

If you truly believe that we are better than Japan and Germany today, in all the things that matter to us in pursuit of a happy and successful life, then I'm sorry, there is no helping you, you are a poor sad, lost soul.

I think that's enough benefits for now. More later if you still need more convincing.

Closer to home, we should take a look at the Un-Australian activity of the founder of the Liberal Party. and John Howard hero, 'Pig Iron' Bob Menzies. Menzies had been loudly criticized for his failure as a 19 year old to volunteer to serve King and Country in WWI. Following an official visit to Nazi Germany in 1938, Menzies had returned with glowing reports about the Hitler regime.
In February 1942, Menzies/Fadden (Fadden was Menzies half wit successor as PM) were a party to the proposed infamous 'Brisbane Line', a proposal that Australia should cede half of the continent to the Japanese, all of that part north of Brisbane. The Menzies proposal was strongly rejected by the Curtain Labor government, which refused to countenance any proposal that would give Japan control of Australian territory. Instead committing to an all out effort to defeat Japan. The Brisbane Line proposal was correctly described by Labor Minister Eddie Ward as "defeatist" and "treacherous". The shocking proposal of Menzies contributed to Curtin and the Labor Party winning the 1943 federal election by a significant margin.

ALTRAV, and where would the Concentration Camps be located? In this Utopian society of National Socialism you so desire.

AH P1405, you mock and you knock and deflect to avoid facing the truth and anything that paints you and your lot in your true colours or light.

If your going to 'try' to win points, at least make them relevant. I could not give a rats arse what Menzies or anyone else tried to do or suggested. I have given you actual acts of treachery and treason not just thinking or talking about it.

The points you asked for have been answered and rather convincingly.

Do I think Australia would have been better off if we were run like Japan and Germany? ABSOLUTELY!

This place has gone to sh!t and anyone with a modicum of maturity and common sense would agree.

There is little or nothing about living in Australia these days, that one can boast or brag about being better than other countries.

You are a second class citizen unless you are an abo a queer or any number of minorities out there.

As to the Colebatch book....

Its jam-packed with stories and details about how the union movement conducted themselves in the war years. But those who want the history to look the the other way have attempted to discredit the book by taking a couple of things they can deem to be errors and the insinuating that the entire book is erroneous. The same tactic was used against Windschuttle's book on the Tasmania.

So they've zeroed in on two supposed errors. First the flight of what Colebatch calls the American Vultee Vengeances. Nowhere does he say that the Americans were flying these planes. He meant were made in America - the same way we might talk about a Japanese Toyota sitting in Broken Hill. But the critics decided to take an ambiguous phrase and assert error. It is likely that the planes were flown by Aussies or NZers and its possible that he has the type of plane wrong. But all that is peripheral since the main point is about the stolen valves. And that's not disputed.

The second 'error' is over the POW ship. It is asserted that there was no POW named Monk(s) and therefore the story is wrong. But it now turns out that such a person did exist. So the critics were wrong, yet continued to assert that Colebatch was wrong.

The point of these criticisms are to give excuses to those who don't want Colebatch's point to be true, to reject it. When Foxy, Paul et al Google "Reasons to reject Colebatch" (or the suchlike) they aren't looking for the truth. they are looking for excuses to reject. That they find lots of people saying the same thing and reading from the same sheet isn't evidence of anything other the echo chamber.

The book has literally hundreds of examples of union bastardary from the war. Even if the two alleged errors were errors, it would be inconsequential in the scheme of things. To get a flavour of the sort of detail in the book, read this article....

http://www.nationalobserver.net/2004_summer_112.htm