Hi David,

Yes, we should condemn the crimes committed in the name of religion of four hundred years ago. We should dig up the bones of those responsible and kick them around the graveyard. That'll feel good.

But a bit of perspective: the Ottomans ruled Greece for around five hundred years, and treated the Greeks as serfs. After the First World War, Britain ruled Iraq as a LoN mandate for thirty years or so, and France ruled Lebanon and Syria for around twenty years. And that was after the Ottomans had ruled them, Turks ruling Arabs, for nearly as long as they had ruled Greece.

Thirty years back from now is only 1987: maybe I'm getting old but that seems like yesterday.

And by the way, the Muslims pinched a lot of their ideas about maths from the Indians, who had developed logarithms a thousand years before, and so probably trigonometry and algebra. And, of course, they 'borrowed' other ideas from the Greeks. Can you explain to us a single mathematical theorem that the Muslims devised on their own ?

Cheers,

Joe

Joe wrote: “And by the way, the Muslims pinched a lot of their ideas about maths from the Indians, who had developed logarithms a thousand years before, and so probably trigonometry and algebra. And, of course, they 'borrowed' other ideas from the Greeks. Can you explain to us a single mathematical theorem that the Muslims devised on their own?”

Dear Joe,

Scientists and mathematicians build on the work of past scientists and mathematicians. Newton developed his law of gravitation incorporating the work of Kepler. Would you criticise Newton because he built on Kepler’s work? The Arabs used the work of those who had come before also. That is how science and mathematics are done. Newton said, “If I have seen further than others, it is by standing on the shoulders of giants.”

From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mathematics_in_medieval_Islam

“Important progress was made, such as the full development of the decimal place-value system to include decimal fractions, the first systematised study of algebra (named for The Compendious Book on Calculation by Completion and Balancing by scholar Al-Khwarizmi), and advances in geometry and trigonometry.”

“In his book The Compendious Book on Calculation by Completion and Balancing, Al-Khwarizmi deals with ways to solve for the positive roots of first and second degree (linear and quadratic) polynomial equations. He also introduces the method of reduction, and unlike Diophantus, gives general solutions for the equations he deals with.”

Omar Khayyám (c. 1038/48 in Iran – 1123/24)[9] wrote the Treatise on Demonstration of Problems of Algebra containing the systematic solution of cubic or third-order equations, going beyond the Algebra of al-Khwarizmi;. Khayyám obtained the solutions of these equations by finding the intersection points of two conic sections. This method had been used by the Greeks, but they did not generalize the method to cover all equations with positive roots.

“Sharaf al-Din al-Tusi; (? in Tus, Iran – 1213/4) developed a novel approach to the investigation of cubic equations—an approach which entailed finding the point at which a cubic polynomial obtains its maximum value. (go to site)

Arab mathematicians also dealt with irrational numbers and developed spherical trigonometry.

david f wrote: "Arab mathematicians also dealt with irrational numbers and developed spherical trigonometry."

Yeah, and even if they didn't, it's important to note that there was a time when the Islamic world was more scholar-friendly than the Christian world.

A reason why the Arab world has been going backwards further and further since the nineteenth century is because Islamists are reigniting old debates, which had been held and settled long ago, about how to interpret the Qur'an, and are, unfortunately, taking a more literal approach than was taken previously.

Hi David,

No, certainly not: Newton was a giant who stood on the shoulders of earlier giants.

My point is the mis-attribution of early discoveries in maths to Muslims, if that infers Arabs: after all, it's notable (unless I'm totally wrong) that the three scholars who you cited were not Arab, core-Muslim, but from either Iranian or central Asian societies, i.e. with scientific heritage from ancient, pre-Muslim civilizations.

Nothing from Muslim Spain, in its supposed glory years, up until around 1100 AD ?

Just a nit-pick, David, sorry :)

Cheers,

Joe

Hi David,

When I say Judaism is an exclusive religion, it certainly was/is when compared to Christianity. There is no evidence that it actively sought converts among gentiles, there was no missionary movement associated with Judaism. In fact Jews considered themselves God's chosen people, at the exclusion of all others. Any converts are more the exception than the rule.
If Christianity, unlike Judaism, had not adopted the degree of flexibility that it did during the Roman era, thanks to Paul, it would never have reached the level of popularity that it enjoys today. In fact it would have been likely that it would have ceased to exist centuries ago. The true founder of Christianity was Paul not Jesus. If the brother of Jesus, James and the leader Peter had held sway Christianity would have clung to its Jewish beliefs, and that would have been disastrous for the new religion.
Jesus was not out to create a new religion called Christianity, with new beliefs and values, but rather attempted to argue reform of the existing Jewish religion by correct interpretation of scripture. It was that which brought Jesus into conflict with the religious leadership of the day. The Romans were concerned with sedition not religion, which when necessary had to be vigorously suppressed.

I agree with Joe (y)