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The Forum > General Discussion > Safe schools Roz ward, exposed as extremist, resigns

Safe schools Roz ward, exposed as extremist, resigns

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Hi Poirot,

I suppose sport isn't necessarily a male thing. That would be a social construct, surely ? In a male-dominated society, girls and women had a subordinate place, and were denied their natural right to get into all sorts of sports as they wished. So really, sport - per se - has little to do with gender. I think Roz Ward is confusing society with biology. Marx wouldn't be pleased.

As well, if I wore women's clothing (I tried it once, great fun, I even found myself walking with a swing in the hips), and grew my hair long (yep, been there, done that) and even tucked the old boy up my arse (yeah, I wish), I would still be a bloke. My DNA would still be YY. I could even get the pillar of love cut off but I would still be a bloke. Similarly, presumably for people with XY chromosome. I can never get pregnant or have kids, no matter how long I grow my hair. Women, no matter how they dress, can, on the whole. Not much fluidity there.

Unless M. Ward means only how one 'feels' ? Well, many times in the street in town, I feel so handsome that I expect pretty women to fall at my feet, but no such luck. Not yet anyway: but hope springs eternal.

Back to bullying. Remember bullying ? At the bus-stop today, watching some younger HS kids horsing around (How come kids can go home at 11.00 am ? What is it with schools these days ? Maybe they were doing gender-fluidity field-work.) and it struck me that they were subconsciously flirting with the idea of being gender-fluid. No worries, they'll grow out of it and be horny as hell in a year or so.

Cheers,

Joe
Posted by Loudmouth, Friday, 3 June 2016 3:17:12 PM
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poirot: When I was expecting my first child, and obviously a little bored,

poirot: I have a hard enough time understanding my wife and daughter."

Well you've confused me again. Which one of the multitude of sexes there seem to be these days, are you? That would give us a better understanding of where you are coming from.
Posted by Jayb, Friday, 3 June 2016 3:22:41 PM
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Poirot:

“Understanding is the first point of departure in treating fellow humans with respect, but yes I agree with the crux of your point. I tend to treat people as I find them regardless of gender.

What's wrong with a program that focuses on respect and tolerance?”

If everyone is due respect then what is there to understand. You just need to know they are a human being and that any disrespect is wrong. You do not need to know that they are different or why they are different. You just need to know that everyone should be accepted. Anyone who abuses or bullies another child for any reason should be pulled into line. That is all the program you need.

There is no need to focus on difference since it is irrelevant. Abusive behaviour should be dealt with full-stop. You can teach an infant to stop abusing another infant by showing them that there are consequences for him if he does it. He does not need to understand the concepts behind it. He just needs to made to stop doing it. That should be the objective anywhere – to stop the bullying.

Giving a child information that it does not need in order to solve a problem is a waste of resources. The school already has the power it needs to control all types of bullying. It is not a lack of knowledge that allows bullying to continue but a lack of control by those who are given the power to control.

When you present information that it is unnecessary to present then it is reasonable to suspect some hidden agenda.
Posted by phanto, Friday, 3 June 2016 3:25:19 PM
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phanto,

That would be all well and good, if bouncing bullies after the act stopped bullying as a social phenomenon. It doesn't.

And that's when bullying is addressed, which in many cases it's not brought to the attention of authority, or in other cases it is, only to be ignored.

Encouraging young people to respect others isn't going to hurt.

.......

Jayb,

Oh well done, Einstein!

"poirot: When I was expecting my first child, and obviously a little bored,

poirot: I have a hard enough time understanding my wife and daughter."

Sorry to burst your bubble, but the first quote was mine.

The second quote, however, was me quoting Shadow Minister (note the quote marks around that passage in my post).

As in:

"I don't give a crap whether someone is male, female or imbetween. I treat them similarly, and don't need to understand their issues. I have a hard enough time understanding my wife and daughter."

"Posted by Shadow Minister, Friday, 3 June 2016 1:52:35 PM"

Next.....
Posted by Poirot, Friday, 3 June 2016 4:30:21 PM
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Poirot:

“That would be all well and good, if bouncing bullies after the act stopped bullying as a social phenomenon. It doesn't.”

Well it doesn’t stop it one hundred per cent but it is the best way we have found yet to curtail unsociable behaviour. It is how we deal with it in every other place in society. I don’t see why the school needs to be different.

“And that's when bullying is addressed, which in many cases it's not brought to the attention of authority, or in other cases it is, only to be ignored.”

If bullying is not being addressed then it should be. This is a failure of those individuals responsible for monitoring and punishing such behaviour. It is not a failure of the principle of punishment for anti-social behaviour. It is like saying that we should abandon the rule of crime and punishment because some criminals get away with it.

“Encouraging young people to respect others isn't going to hurt.”

That is already implicit in the principle to which everyone adheres when they agree that all human beings should be respected without exception. You cannot state it more clearly than that. That is all the bully, or any potential bully, needs to know. They also need to know that if they do not behave according to that principle they will be punished.

What does the Safe Schools program add to the mix that is not already there?
Posted by phanto, Friday, 3 June 2016 5:52:49 PM
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Hi Poirot,

I'm intrigued by the phenomenon of bullying. I wonder if it ever occurred before, say, 2007 or 2008. Yes, I believe it did. Gosh it probably occurred fifty years ago, even a hundred years ago. Maybe it's been around for thousands of years.

Now what was done about it in my young days ? The teacher on play-ground duty stopped it. End. Otherwise the kids themselves found 'ways'. Bullies were usually big kids, ultimately gutless. Probably most were knocked about by their dads. They were usually unpopular. But they were not unknown, Poirot. And I don't recall, in Primary School OR in Secondary school, if they ever targeted homosexually-oriented kids, as far as we could tell. Perhaps the reverse. Little kids, yes. Fat kids, yes. Ethnic kids, like Balts, yes. But homosexual kids, I don't think they would have had a clue. Bullying is more to do with picking on those perceived as weak.

And surely we should stand up for the weak, the powerless, the friendless, in society ? [Trick question]

Cheers,

Joe
Posted by Loudmouth, Friday, 3 June 2016 7:04:25 PM
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