Governments pay rewards for information leading to the apprehension of alleged criminals. Isn't that so ? Is that illegal, or even immoral ?

Police no doubt pay informers as long as their information is useful. Isn't that so ? Is that outside the law, or even particularly immoral ?

The Federal government has a policy of stopping illegal boat-loads of illegal immigrants from reaching Australia. Support it or not, any properly-elected government is within its rights to enforce that policy.

If boats leave Indonesia without proper clearances for their passengers to leave Indonesia, then that's more likely where an offence has occurred.

Australian officials stop the boats, pay off the crews (and pretty cheaply, by the sound of it), either transfer passengers to safer boats or simply re-fuel the ones the poor silly buggers have paid to get on, and turn them back to Indonesia.

Illegal ? Probably not.

Immoral ? Probably not.

Effective ? Probably. How many more people will willingly pay money, only to get a round trip back to Indonesia ? Probably none.

Ah, so that's why some people are exercising themselves over this, along with that little girl, SHY: because it will probably work.

Right. So let's get back to processing genuine refugees, in hell-holes around the world, people who have been in them for decades, and who have had no alternative but to wait their turn.

THEY are the people we should be feeling compassionate about. Double the quota for truly desperate people, by all means. But don't just look for sticks to shove up the government; don't just use illegal immigrants for your own purposes.

Joe

Oh, seemed I missed that one eh, A.J.PHILIPS... I completely overlooked that small 'gem' from you ! Another clear sign of my rapidly approaching dotage ?

So you assert '...raciest stereotypes are a coping mechanism for police...' are they now how very interesting ? And how would you know ?

You see A.J.P, this is precisely what I meant when I said, I didn't like the arrogant way, in which you prosecute your opinions ? And here's an example ? You've never been a copper, so how would you know ? What do you mean, by 'raciest stereotyping' ? What relevance does it have with stress ? What stress, for whom, and what circumstance, precipitates this mythical 'stress' ?

Dear ConservativeHippie,

I see no relevance because one is
accused of committing illegal acts during his time
as Australia's Prime Minister. The American President
was being slurred for his birth certificate. A time
for which he cannot be held accountable - surely
even in your eyes. Chalk and cheese between the two
cases. And if you can't see the difference between
the two, then you do have serious problems of judgement.

Well Foxy, I have obviously trumped you as it appears you've wigged-out in total denial with that flawed logic.

Do you wear a diamond studded eye-patch or the common pirate style?

You don't see the relevance because you don't want too. Obama was only being 'slurred' where condemning Abbott publically without the solid evidence is not slurring.

Why can't you get this in your head, Abbott did not pay anyone! Abbott has not personally committed any crime and you cannot provide any proof he did. Do you think he quickly flew up there, paid off the crew, flew back and now denies it? Obviously he didn't so you have nothing on him personally.

Would it kill you to say Abbott has allegedly condoned the payment rather than repeatedly claiming Abbott has committed illegal activities. Can you name the specific law Abbott supposed broke that would constitute an illegal activity. Come on, what law is it?

Your hypocrisy shows when you completely ignore commenting on the strong possibility the Labor government has done the same thing. Where is your outrage in this regard?

One thing you have proven time and time again is once you make up your mind on an issue you are not going to give an inch, regardless of how faulty your argument might be.

This is too much like arguing with a stubborn woman, to continue any further.

o sung wu,

There's a lot of people on OLO that I don't like, but I'm not rude enough to tell them.

Of course you're not going to like me. You like to feel like you're somewhat of an expert on criminal justice matters (and after 35 years experience, you ought to be) so when someone shows you to be wrong on the topic, the frustration of that is going to be interpreted as a problem inherent with the other person (e.g. an arrogance) and manifest as a disliking for them. That being said, I'm not really a "know all". The more I learn the more I realise I don't know.

I'd be interested to hear what this criminologist said that was so wrong. Perhaps all his former-cop colleagues hadn't corrected him? Speaking of which, I had three lecturers who were once police (they always had interesting stories to tell), and a lecture one of them was giving made me think of you. He was discussing the ways police exacerbate tensions with ethnic groups and I imagined you shaking your head and saying, "What would be know?!"

<<So you assert '...raciest stereotypes are a coping mechanism for police...' are they now how very interesting ? And how would you know ?>>

Because that's what the evidence suggests. I'll let you do the research on that one. That's not always going to be the case, of course.

<<What do you mean, by 'raciest stereotyping' ?">>

You know, assuming that all "Lebs" are the same, for example. Do I really need to explain such simple concepts? You know what racism and stereotyping are.

<<What relevance does it have [to do] with stress ?>>

I already explained that.

<<What stress, for whom...>>

The stress of dealing with unpredictable and potentially dangerous situations. Less thought is required when assumptions can be made about certain groups.

<<...and what circumstance, precipitates this mythical 'stress' ?>>

Oh come now. Don't pretend you didn't know that policing is highly stressful.

Anyway, can I take it that you had no way of measuring the criminality of asylum seekers?

Foxy,

You have not yet established that any "illegal" activities occurred (other than the illegal attempt to smuggle people)