http://www.globalresearch.ca/twenty-six-things-about-the-islamic-state-isil-that-obama-does-not-want-you-to-know-about/5414735

Do you think Prof Michel Chossudousky is right about ISIL ?

The philosophy and tactics of ISIL are perfectly consistent with other historical militant Islamic movements so the most plausible explanation is that they're the real thing.

There's absolutely no doubt whatsoever that the USA has happily supported terrorism and bloodshed when it's been in the interests of the USA; you just need to look at the USA history of the past 70 years. I have no doubt that if in the future it was in the interests of the USA to see Australia bombed, the USA would happily watch on or do it themselves if they thought it necessary.

Having said that, the USA is NO different in this regard than Russia, China, Indonesia, North Korea, Germany, Japan and virtually any other country. As Australia is "currently" aligned with the USA, we therefore are not "currently" threatened by the USA.

The USA foreign military policy is corrupt and rotten to the core, but so are virtually all other countries. That's the way mankind was behaving 40,000 years ago, we're still doing it, and we'll still be doing it in another 40,000 years. And we think we're an advanced species, ha ha ha.

Despite overwhelming evidence and a confession, the article linked to makes the extraordinary claim that Al Qaeda was not behind the 9/11 Attacks! It's author's failed to make the distinction between genuine faults in America's actions and silly conspiracy theories.

From the link - The incursion of the Islamic State (IS) brigades into Iraq starting in June 2014 was part of a carefully planned military-intelligence operation supported covertly by the US, NATO and Israel.

"The Islamic State (IS) militia, which is currently the alleged target of a US-NATO bombing campaign under a “counter-terrorism” mandate, continues to be supported covertly by the US. Washington and its allies continue to provide military aid to the Islamic State."

So are the Australian forces bombing ISIL or not? Are you saying it's all a big fabrication? Next you'll be telling us the USA never landed on the moon.

Con hippie, you have not obiviously viewed the article thus are not really qualified to comment.

Our humanity is already down the toilet of truth and integrity. Our Western masters of deception have perverted the course of all humanity. It is now a matter of redemption and whether we have the courage and fortitude to achieve it.

Arjay,
That last post sounds like something ISIS would put out.
People like Global Research and Storm Clouds Gathering are just another sect of frustrated Leftists, the world is ruled by the human nature of the masses not by science or phoney enlightenment "morality", as it turns out race, religion, social class and family are the most important things in the world after all.

Aidan see http://www.ae911truth.org/ Al Qaeda did not plan or execute 911.They did not have access to Nano Thermite the major explosive which brought down all 3 towers. Nano Thermite in 2001 could only be created by the US or Israeli Military. Very few people knew about it.

As Prof Chossudovsky says, ISIL is just a form of Al Qaeda created by US/Israeli intelligence. They could have easily eliminated ISIL as easily as they did Saddham but need them to wreak havoc in Iraq and Syria.

The longer term plan is to take Iran and run a pipeline through Syria to Europe and be competition to Putin's energy supplies there. Europe is siding with Russia and heaven forbid the Russians kicked out the Rothschild Bankers. If Europe does likewise,the Central Bankers who created this crisis will be finished.

From Arjay - Con hippie, you have not obiviously viewed the article thus are not really qualified to comment.

What article did I copy and paste the quotes from then? I used your link.

The difference is, I don't believe it.

Back in the 1970's Zbigniew Brezezinski Was the National Security advisor for the USA. Here you will see him side by side with a young Tim Osman known today as Osama Bin Laden. Bin Laden was working with the USA fighting against the Russians. The Taliban had stopped production of heroin in 2000 thus there was a huge shortage. Today Afghanistan supplies 90% of the world's heroin.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OJTv2nFjMBk

Brezezinski had the Russians convinced that the USA was going to take Afghanistan and be on their doorstep. Brezezinski wanted Afganistan to be their Vietnam and break the USSR economically.In the early 90's the USSR collapsed and Western Bankers like the Rothschilds were able to get a foothold and enslave them in debt just like we are.

In his book called 'The Grand Chessboard' Brezezinski said in 1996 that" What we need is a massive and widely perceived direct external threat." These words were echoed by some saying " We need a new Pearl Harbour." 911 was that new Peal Harbour which justified wars of aggression to steal oil and resources from many countries.

When Putin came to power, he paid off the debt, nationalised resources and kicked the Rothschild Bankers out. This is why Putin is now being demonised.

Gough Whitlam and Rex Connor wanted buy back Australia,that's why Gough was sacked. Both Labor and the Coalition sold off 4 State Govt Banks and the Commonwealth.Our total debt is now over $5 trillion which is 3.3 times our GDP.

Arjay, first you believe the CEC, now you're getting your information from twoofer websites — next week will you be claiming the Apollo moon landings were faked?!?!?

Neither nano thermite nor ordinary thermite destroyed the WTC; fire did. The twin towers were badly damaged by the impact of the planes, then the burning aviation fuel and burning aluminium (didn't you know the aircraft were made of Aluminium?) weakened it enough to cause a collapse. Tower 7 had been hit by a lot of debris, and was ultimately destroyed by a fire that no attempt was being made to extinguish.

And despite what the twoofers claim, the towers didn't collapse at freefall speed. It was about half way between freefall seed and perfectly inelastic collision speed.

Nah, Aidan...

>>next week will you be claiming the Apollo moon landings were faked?!?!?<<

...that was last week.

And the best of luck trying to introduce Arjay to reality. After a year or two you will find that he talks up a merry conspiracy storm, but doesn't actually listen at all.

There's a trick to carrying out terrorist 'spectaculars"...don't tell anyone what you're about to do,take a blood oath, swear your brothers in arms to secrecy on pain of death, works every time.
As for ISIS, if it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it's probably a duck, to a reasonable person and based on historical precedent ISIS is more likely to be a bona fide Islamic movement than a construct of the CIA.

My usual detractors cannot argue the evidence and try to label all my points as ridiculous conspiracy yet again.

Pericles and Aidan ,how is it possible that 3 buildings on 911 came down at near freefall speeds when physics tells us that it is impossible without controlled demolition ? You cannot answer and deflect arguments to personal attacks which means you are either covering up the truth or suffer cognitive dissonance.

Neither of you have refuted points made by Prof Chossudovsky or myself in any logical fashion.

Arjay I answered your question before you asked it:
And despite what the twoofers claim, the towers didn't collapse at freefall speed. It was about half way between freefall speed and perfectly inelastic collision speed.

BTW animosity to Putin is nothing to do with bankers or pipelines: it's because he's invaded neighbouring countries, because he isn't supporting the rule of law in his own country, and because it's very likely (>95% IMO) that he was behind a bombing he blamed on Chechens in order to justify another war against Chechnya.

Aidan you answered nothing. It's wrong because I say its wrong is not answer. Concrete reinforced steel building have never come down due to fires. Fires have consumed entire buildings and raged for 24 hours and never fallen. The fires of 911 burned for 1 hr in the towers and kerosene fires never get anywhere near the temps to melt steel.

Your just another troll Aidan.

Excellent article. Will the West go for all out war against Russia/China ? Our criminal war mongering banking oligarchs such as the Rothschilds are being cornered. Can they bring on a nuke war and be safe in their underground bunkers ?
http://www.globalresearch.ca/why-putin-is-winning-the-new-cold-war/5417041

"Can they bring on a nuke war and be safe in their underground bunkers ?"

Not if they are as imagined as that bunker you assured us was under Canberra's Parliament House, but isn't... remember that one? Also, one month left for gold to get to $7,000 an ounce.

Meanwhile, this Putin/Rothschilds issue is so earthshatteringly important that your favourite source rt.com seems to have ignored it on its news pages except for this from two years ago:

http://rt.com/business/aar-rothschilds-bp-stake-399/

Why?

Meantime, extending Pericles' phrase, I'd like to wish you a 'merry conspiracy' and a harping new year.

The people debunking this article are, like everyone else, the victims of their own country's propaganda. When all their lives people have only been told one side of every international and national incident, the side that suits their government and big business, then it's sad, but not surprising when faced with the whole truth, that they are unable to accept it and pretend it is a conspiracy, a fabrication, a beat up. But the complete facts speak for themselves. The USA and its allies have been fomenting discord all over the planet for well over a century in order to gain whatever they need. "Countries are “pieces on a chessboard upon which is being played out a great game for the domination of the world,” wrote Lord Curzon, Viceroy of India, in 1898. Nothing has changed. Western aggression has sparked most of the trouble from which 'terrorism' has ensued. [Although why murdering thousands of innocent men women and children in the Middle East with drones piloted by young men in the USA isn't terrorism beats me.] To expand your horizons a little, Aidan, JofM, WmT et al, check out ICH http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/ for a week or so and read articles by well informed academics with no axe to grind apart from a desire for truth in reporting. You will never read a balanced report on anything in our newspapers or hear it on our radios or TV because they're all owned and censored by people with an interest in maintaining the status quo.

In regard to the "silly conspiracy theories" that al quaeda was not responsible for 9/11, it would depend on where the buck stopped.
The attack was probably carried out by al quaeda but was "overwatched" and "protected" by US security agents to ensure it's success.
Anyone who believes that the passport found a few blocks away from the twin towers owned by one of the "perps", the list of activists obtained within hours by the US security departments and to top it off the collapse of building 7 are deluding them selves.
See the video of Bush reading to the kids and watch his face.

Ybgirp,
I've been a social media subscriber of those "Alt-news" people, Maram Susli, James Corbett, Storm Clouds Gathering, Ryan Dawson, Pepe Escobar etc for a few years so I'm au fait wit the milieu and their views.

For Arjay to ponder.

Why WTC buildings collapsed:

http://www.civil.northwestern.edu/people/bazant/PDFs/Papers/405.pdf
http://www.springerlink.com/content/g5w603461r3078t3/?p=af305ef1f04243598e063b8d0de84c14&pi=3
http://www.springerlink.com/content/9615qr01381223n4/?p=59edf424180f428ab5b595731dea5e07&pi=12
http://www.springerlink.com/content/f08uu7jk6t821848/
http://www.springerlink.com/content/113x89267395h768/
http://www.springerlink.com/content/p42m41t753721442/?p=59edf424180f428ab5b595731dea5e07&pi=15
http://link.springer.com/article/10.1361%2F154770206X129051
http://cedb.asce.org/cgi/WWWdisplay.cgi?0500041
http://www.springerlink.com/content/lp0431483014j475/
http://cedb.asce.org/cgi/WWWdisplay.cgi?0800818
http://www.civil.northwestern.edu/people/bazant/PDFs/Papers/00%20WTC%20Collapse%20-%20What%20Did%20&%20Did%20Not%20Cause%20It.pdf
http://cedb.asce.org/cgi/WWWdisplay.cgi?0303235

Agronomist. I've met Richard Gage the founder of http://ae911truth.org/ Also Prof Steven Jones, our Dr Frank Legge and Prof Niels Harritt who led the investigation into the explosives they used ie Nano Thermite. I know the truth and the official story is full of holes.

Aiden>>Neither nano thermite nor ordinary thermite destroyed the WTC; fire did.<<

On 11 September 2001 three world firsts occurred....what are the odds?

The International Association for Bridge and Structural Engineering maintain a record of major structural collapses from high rise structures from all around the world. The term “full structural collapse” in a high rise only occurs three times in these reports....only three from all their reports into high rise disasters.....and all in one place, all on the same day.....as I said , what are the odds.

Never before had a high rise fallen into its own footprint due to fire or plane strike or fire, never. The Empire State Bldg was struck by a cargo plane, 20 Wall street was struck by a plane, the Al Rasheed Hotel was struck by a plane, the Pirelli Tower was struck by a plane, they all survived.

Aiden the Serbians shelled the UNITIC Twin Towers with incendiary shells for two days....it all burnt....everything, but the frame was still there.


The Bush administration spent over $60 million investigating Clintons sex life while President...they gave the 9/11 Commission $14 million. What were all the secondary explosions on ground level and in the basements of the twin towers and bldg 7 before they collapsed.....it all just stinks.

Christine Lagarde is head of the IMF.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QYmViPTndxw&feature=youtu.be

Lagarde, "Today I'm going to test your numerology skills by asking you to think about the magic number 7.Most of you know that 7 is quite a number. I'm sure you can compress numbers as well.If we think about 2014,you drop the zero. 2X7=14"

Now note two important dates.Twin Towers 9/11/2001 Using Lagarde's numerology skills 9+1+1+2+1 = 14 or 2X7=14. London Bombings. 7/7/2005 7+7+2+5 = 21 or 3X7 = 21

What is the probability that these two dates fit perfectly into Christine Lagarde's numerology logic ? These evil elites like to telegraph their intent as it gives them the ultimate rush when it their crimes are enacted.

Agronomist, this quote from your first link.

"As for the cause of collapse of the adjacent 47 story building,"
"if no aircraft fuel is injected into the building it seems that there "may" have been a huge unstoppable gas leak in the foundation, and that a storage of diesel fuel in the building "may" have been ignited. This "may" have heated the floors near the ground for a long time. That "may" explain why this building collapsed like in a demolition."

Well that scribe certainly sounds confident, I will finish it off or him...June July August September...11.....

Not to mention the Aussie connection, our own Frank Lowie and his mate Larry Silverstein signed leases on WTC buildings six weeks before 9/11.........they cleaned up....the insurance companies had to pay them double indemnity because it was a “terrorist” attack.......

Regarding Bldg 7, watch this clip where Larry tells the NYFD to “pull it” then says, “we watched the building come down”..............he will later recount that he meant “pull the fire fighters and bystanders away from the building as in “pull them out”..........but he uses the generic term for building demolition.....inarticulate for a career property developer.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p34XrI2Fm6I

The NYFD are in the wrong business given they can demolish a high rise into its own footprint with half an hour’s notice.

Agronomist, it stinks mate.

Neils Harritt didn't lead any investigation in the collapse of the building. What he did was supposedly test some dust obtained more than 6 years later from various truthers and confused paint chips for thermite material. His whole paper is a complete joke published in a joke journal that publishes anything you like as long as you pay them.

Agronimist well Niels Harritt was the spokesperson for them and there were from memory 9 scientists from many countries who presented a peer reviewed paper that has not been disproven. It is ignored for good reasons. See this cretin BBC reporter trying to pervert Harritt's logic. Harritt shoots him to pieces. Youtube is taking down many videos on 911.Why ?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XF334x-xWz8

The third building came down on 9/11 because it was found to be unsafe, probably unsafe due to ground concussion caused by the falling twin towers, and so building 7 was immediately demolished to allow the rescues to continue.
http://www.foreignpolicyjournal.com/2011/02/14/a-scientific-theory-of-the-wtc-7-collapse

JF the third building WTC 7 which no plane hit had minor fires in it. It was in good condition other than that. Larry Silverstein in his classic slip of the tongue said because of the damage we had to "pull it" and we watched the building come down.

"Pull it" is a demolition term used to remove the structural integrity of a building with explosives. Larry initially did not realise that it takes weeks to prepare building for demolition.He though it would take hours. So said he meant to pull the fireman out but they were out hours before.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p34XrI2Fm6I

It is totally unambiguous as to what Silverstein meant. I think a third plane was intended to hit WTC 7.It was probably the one that crashed in Shanksville.

Our intelligence and military can now put us on kill lists like Obama has done and simply remove any one of us if we are defined as a threat to national security. It would make Hitler very proud. http://www.globalresearch.ca/new-australian-terrorism-bill-to-facilitate-targeted-military-killings/5417140

Arjay,
Even I know how to position explosives to snap piers holding a building up. A phone call can have explosives delivered same day if an explosives company places the order.
There was an emergency at 9/11. The area had to be made safe asap. It was not a matter of bringing a building down in a quiet normal city where meticulous explosives planning is required.
The third building was declared unsafe and the area was already a massive mess and in turmoil.
The situation would have been like immediately after a severe storm with trees and wires down and need to immediately cut the trees and wires to make the area safe for rescue teams.

The non-sense being said about nuclear bombs and conspiracy at 9/11 involves deception and naievity and/or stupidity.
It is even being said there were no aircraft involved.
The nonsense and stupidity is extraordinary.

JF Aus>>and so building 7 was immediately demolished to allow the rescues to continue.<<

JF, you can immediately blow up a building....but it takes weeks of preperation to blow a building down......into its own footprint.

sonofgloin,
I disagree because a few van loads of explosives can be driven into a carpark and positioned and wired to snap foundation piers simultaneously on the same day, if you know what you are doing.
And the demolition of that 3rd building was done by an expert.
I think it would be the planning and safety approvals that would take the time under normal circumstances of building demolition.
Anyway, aliens did not do it! LOL

JF "Even I know how to position explosives to snap piers holding a building up. A phone call can have explosives delivered same day if an explosives company places the order." JF to wire a building for controlled demolition means drilling holes into crucial structural points and placing explosives in them.

It takes a team of engineers with plans of the building weeks just to work out where the explosives should be positioned. Lack of accuracy means the building falls over onto other buildings. So how do you deliver tonnes of explosives and co-ordinate a team of engineers and explosive experts in 5 hrs? Your assumptions are absolute rubbish.

None can address my previous post about Christine Lagarde head of the IMF.What is the probability of the 911 attacks and the London Bombings fitting exactly her numerology logic ?

Christine Lagarde is head of the IMF.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QYmViPTndxw&feature=youtu.be

Lagarde, "Today I'm going to test your numerology skills by asking you to think about the magic number 7.Most of you know that 7 is quite a number. I'm sure you can compress numbers as well.If we think about 2014,you drop the zero. 2X7=14"

Now note two important dates.Twin Towers 9/11/2001 Using Lagarde's numerology skills 9+1+1+2+1 = 14 or 2X7=14. London Bombings. 7/7/2005 7+7+2+5 = 21 or 3X7 = 21

What is the probability that these two dates fit perfectly into Christine Lagarde's numerology logic ? These evil elites like to telegraph their intent as it gives them the ultimate rush when it their crimes are enacted.

Arjay
Usually you sound intelligent but then it seems like there is lead in the pipes where you live.

Bin Ladin's mob demolished the two 9/11 towers in their own footprint without drilling any holes.

What assumption are you referring to?
I did not assume what I wrote. And make it 15 hours, not 5.

I think you are actually the one making assumptions.
You assume there are IMF "evil elites" practicing "numerology logic".
And you (and others) assume there is magic in a number.
You even assume I am making assumptions.

Try being logical and send me next week's winning Lotto numbers.

JF Aust ,you still make no sense. Just google controlled demo and time taken to execute it.911 was 13 years ago and the technology was far more inferior.

The probability of these two dates 9/11/2001 and 7/7/2005 coinciding with Largade's numerology analysis would be in the millions. But you won't address that reality.

"These evil elites like to telegraph their intent as it gives them the ultimate rush when it their crimes are enacted."

Hardly telegraphing when it is thirteen and nine years after the two dates you confect as using Lagarde's logic, Arjay.

Read the transcript and the context of her jocular introduction makes sense. Even the audience laughed.

http://www.imf.org/external/np/tr/2014/tr011514.pdf

"So my hope and my wish for 2014 is that after those seven miserable years, weak and fragile, we have seven strong years. I don't know whether the G7 will have anything to do with it, or whether it will be the G20. I certainly hope that the IMF will have something to do with it."

You might be better suggesting that Pharaoh's dream in Genesis 41 telegraphed 9/11... lots of sevens there.

WM Trevor, the plan is to make "special drawing rights" of the IMF the new reserve currency as the US $ collapses. James Rickards has echoed these intentions, however the BRICS nations have come up with their new Development Bank and this is why the West threatens war with Russia/China.

Arjay, an occassional apology after being shown you are wrong wouldn't go astray as you pretend no-one noticed before attempting to redirect (or is it misdirect) our attention...

"James Rickards has echoed these intentions, however the BRICS nations have come up with their new Development Bank and this is why the West threatens war with Russia/China."

Maybe you shouldn't get too hung up on the 'C' part of BRICS...

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/10/06/us-investment-author-financialpanics-idUSKCN0HV12720141006

When Chris Taylor at Reuters asked Rickards, "Where might the next panic begin?"

His reply: "It could begin in a lot of different places. But one place to keep a close eye on is China, which is on the verge of a major credit collapse. That could be the one snowflake that starts the global avalanche."

But the amusing thing would be that the world's system could be left with a BRIS, leaving financiers to experience a different type of cut than their hair.

Wm trevor, Rickards has serious connections with the CIA and central bankers. They pay him for his advice. Rickards and others know the whole system is going down and so he like his bankers are playing both sides. While China is in trouble they have many Govt banks and not the debt exposure to our criminal banksters.

The BRICS Development Bank is all about new growth and not the scorched earth policies of the West that want austerity to pay banksters interest on money they have counterfeited.

The printed money is still there, it hasn,t gone anywhere, or been used. IT was printed as a safeguard, against short term capital overrun.
In other words it takes time to sell of realestate to supply the banks with cash.
That money never came into play, and is not available for borrowing.

Hi Everyone,

Firstly I think the author of the original article is mostly on the right track, but maybe incorrect on just a couple of points.

For roots of the Mujahideen and Al Qaeda watch this video.
http://youtu.be/C-fM7i2GW0k

For everyone who thinks all Muslims are evil and that they all support IS and the Islamic Caliphate this isn't correct and this video proves it.
What would the people here think if an Islamic scholar said the whole thing was bogus?
http://youtu.be/2HidSGE_3BM

For me the bigger picture is the eventual bringing in of a global government.
One of the things that sealed it for me was this video which aired on Australian TV in 1977 (only watched it recently) called UFO's Are Here with Stan Deyo. He mentions the suppression of anti-grav and zero-point energy (free energy) technology and mentions the Illuminati, Council of Foreign Relations and the Club of Rome. He said that they are suppressing this knowledge because of all the wars in the world, and will release this knowledge only when there is a global government in place.
http://youtu.be/vOYrsAbb3PY (interview with Stan Deyo is at 58:50)

Arjay thanks heaps for posting the article.
You should however stay away from posting about the numerology stuff.
Whether there's anything to it or not, it just makes us look more crazy, and gives people reason to disbelieve all the other topics. There's heaps of disinformation out there and you need to be mindful to stay away from it lest you end up doing more harm than good, but I agree with mostly everything you put forward.

As for 911, forget the WTC and focus on the Pentagon.
I think people are less likely to find argument in this aspect of 911.
There's no way it was hit with a plane.

ybgirp, I agree, people ridicule us because their minds just cannot accept the possibility that we might be right and it completely challenges their belief systems. Good post.

And Aiden, I think I read that the building that came down in Chechnya was actually a false flag attack, as Russia claimed.

It is amazing at the amount of conspiracy's out there. As the years roll on they just move the dates to keep their own conspiracy alive.
Would be movie makers and any one else that wants to invent a conspiracy.
Any truth what so ever is long lost, on such sites. People that get taken in by such tripe are gullible.

Hello 579
There's 3 sides to every story, yours, mine and the actual truth.
I prefer not to think of myself as conspiracy theorist, but rather a truth seeker. Just mentioning the word conspiracy makes one look like a kook and that's exactly the way the people that do go about manipulation and deceitful acts want it.

I have to ask, Quote" As the years roll on they just move the dates to keep their own conspiracy alive."

Can you please indulge us with an example of this?
The reason I ask is if this is incorrect and you can't provide an example, then its people like yourself that contribute to the same trend of thinking that helps to make the so-called conspiracies possible. There's a lot disinformation out there and crazy conspiracy theories. They do this in order to discredit conspiracy theorists and make them look more like crazy people, to take credibility and attention away from the real conspiracies, so that people like yourself can stay in your little bubble with your belief system unchallenged and not take the time to question things.

Armchair,
I wasn't referring to the Chechnya building, but rather the 1999 apartment bombings.
They're far more likely to be a conspiracy than anything America's done in the 21st century.

And there's no way the Pentagon wasn't hit by a plane. How anyone could seriously think the Americans could hijack a plane full of passengers, land it without anyone noticing, and seriously damage part of the Pentagon building to make it look like the plane has hit it is more likely than a terrorist organisation (which subsequently boasted about it) hijacked the plane and crashed it into the Pentagon is beyond me.

___________________________________________________________________________________________

Arjay, do you know anything about structural engineering?
The WTC towers relied on trusses to support the floors (whereas many skyscrapers use frames instead). And steel does not have to melt to lose its strength.
No skyscraper had previously been hit by a wide body plane.
And the WTC did not collapse at freefall speed.

As for probability, you're way off. The probability of something that's already happened having happened is 1. The probability of the digits of a random number adding up to a multiple of seven isn't in the millions, it's 1 in 7.

Aidan I personally met Prof Steven Jones who speciality is physics and Prof Niels Harrit whose speciality is chemistry.http://www.ae911truth.org/ I 've taught mathematics at a high school level. John Bursill is a Qantas engineer and the face of 911 truth Australia. He knows that jet fuel cannot possibly melt steel to cause such destruction we witnessed. There are now 2300 Architects and Engineers who attest to the impossibility of NIST saying it was a gravitational collapse due to fire.

So don't give me the BS of near freefall being not enough. Gravitional collapses happen at nowhere near freefall. You don't know what you are talking about and are just an agent of deception.

http://www.infowars.com/spending-bill-grants-half-billion-to-isis-linked-syrian-rebels/

...And most the people here treat Arjay and myself like were nuts.
Yet we have countless documents and articles that support a different view. When are you people going to wake up and realise that your all being sold into lies and that despite the way you feel about us, its you that are being mislead?

Treat us like idiots if you want.
But we only have good intentions, we open ourselves up to others scrutiny trying to give you all a different point of view.

Its easy to follow the crowd, but it takes a lot more courage to put yourself out there against accepted views only to face ridicule and disbelief.

What about molten metal in the rubble of Building 7?
I suppose that was because of burning fuel as well?
http://wtc7.net/articles/stevenjones_b7.html
http://youtu.be/yea2T3Haux0

Molten metal found in WTC rubble is to be expected, melted aluminium for example.

Spilled jet fuel combined with burning plastic fed with oxygen from any draught forming a blowtorch effect would surely make enough heat to at least crack concrete surrounding the steel structure. Exposed steel could surely soften and bend under weight of upper floors. Perhaps some WTC steel could also melt.

A propane blowtorch can produce 3,623 F.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propane_torch

Steel melts at 2,600 - 2,800 F.
http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/melting-temperature-metals-d_860.html

Propane is a component of petroleum, so is plastic.

Maybe gas from burning plastic coupled with refined kerosene jet fuel could form propane or something like it.

Who on OLO has experience with these components and temperatures?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adiabatic_flame_temperature

Has anyone seen any comment about steel melting due to heat from plastic burning in the WTC on 9/11

Its a big ask to suggest burning plastic and fuel will melt steel.
But granted - I'm no expert.
Even so it can't apply to the tower that wasn't hit.

The internet contains very many well written and researched articles and essays by men who have held top positions in the USA government, academia, the military and commerce, who are attempting to warn the doubting public of what has been planned for them by the so-called neo-cons who run the White House. For years those people have conspired to create confusion, to destabilize governments, to make excuses to invade, to interfere with the financial sector, manipulate the price of precious metals and more, so as to increase their wealth and power. And their conspiracies have been successful. 5% of the population own 85% of the wealth...or some similarly astonishing figure, and in all their vassal states such as Australia, similar changes are occurring. How can they do this? By labeling anyone and everyone who exposes their machinations as a "Conspiracy Theorist". And most of the respondents on this thread have fallen for the lie. They aren't theories, they're facts, and the ultimate truth will almost certainly be far worse than 'nice' people can imagine.

Armchair Critic,
The third building was demolished by a demolition expert because during the initial search and rescue, that was found to be unsafe following the impact of one or both of the two WTC towers hitting the ground.

Hi everyone,

JF Aus,
I don't think they could rig a building for demolition that quickly.
But just suggesting that opens up the question of whether the twin towers were rigged too.

ybgirp,
Thanks for backing me up.
As for the rest of you disbelievers you might find this new video I found really interesting.
http://youtu.be/8hh-1V4nvGg

Its funny he mentions Sheldon Adelson (A Jewish businessman who owns Casinos in Las Vegas and is worth 38bn, and who has also bought both sides of US congress and runs a powerful Israeli Lobby group http://www.israeliamerican.org/ )

He also mentions John McCain the Neocon warmonger who previously wanted to arm ISIS and is widely expected to become the next US Armed Services Committee chairman in January.

http://bluenationreview.com/john-mccain-circa-2013-arm-isis/
http://www.nationaljournal.com/defense/john-mccain-poised-to-control-senate-s-defense-policy-20141105

My feelings and fears are that it all goes back to this 11year old video.
http://youtu.be/DeQ_wfUBjws
(Go to 30:00 min mark or watch the whole thing)
And this.
http://moroccantimes.com/2014/07/nsa-documents-reveal-isis-leaderabu-bakr-al-baghdadi-trained-israeli-mossad/
And this.
http://www.google.com.au/?gfe_rd=cr&ei=CxqPVNSJCabu8wfTw4GwAQ&gws_rd=ssl#q=if+syria+falls+israel+go+to+war
Israel is already targeting Syrian S-300 air defenses.
http://www.jpost.com/Middle-East/Report-Israeli-airstrikes-strike-targets-in-Syria-near-Damascus-383902

The stuff going on in the world isn't happening by accident.
http://youtu.be/nUCwCgthp_E

You cant look at all this stuff and say that I'm making it up.
And even so I'm just a person looking at things on the internet and pointing out info.
You decide.

So yes I do mostly agree with the original article Arjay mentioned.

http://mic.com/articles/61703/why-iran-won-t-back-down-if-we-go-to-war-with-syria-and-assad

This whole thing could be an end game scenario.
All that needs to happen for Sheikh Imran Hosein to be right in his 11year old video is if US and Russia go to a nuclear war.

Do you think the fall in the oil price is happening by accident?

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-10-10/why-oil-plunging-other-part-secret-deal-between-us-and-saudi-arabia

http://nypost.com/2014/12/14/saudi-arabias-oil-war-against-iran-and-russia-2/

http://www.forbes.com/sites/louiswoodhill/2014/03/03/its-time-to-drive-russia-bankrupt-again/

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-10-15/putin-warns-nuclear-power-consequences-if-attempts-blackmail-russia-dont-stop

Am I the only one who sees the danger in what really might be going on in the world?
Cant anyone else see the big picture and the danger we all face?

Armchair Critic "Am I the only one who sees the danger in what really might be going on in the world?
Can't anyone else see the big picture and the danger we all face?"
"The masses have never thirsted after truth. Whoever can supply them with illusions is easily their master; whoever attempts to destroy their illusions is always their victim". Gustave Le Bon;"The Crowd"
Everyone can see it, AC but the majority of humans have been brainwashed as children to believe in gods for which there is zero evidence, and thus to ignore facts for which there is a host of evidence. This is the inevitable result of insisting on faith rather than reason. As for the USA being a terror state capable of any horror, This has long been the opinion of observers. See quote in following post.

116 years ago Frederick Douglass wrote this:
"As a people, Americans are remarkably familiar with all facts which make in their own favor. - Whatever makes for the wealth or for the reputation of Americans, and can be had cheap! will be found by Americans.
 
America is false to the past, false to the present, and solemnly binds herself to be false to the future.
 
Your celebration is a sham; your boasted liberty, an unholy license; your national greatness, swelling vanity; your sounds of rejoicing are empty and heartless; your denunciations of tyrants, brass fronted impudence; your shouts of liberty and equality, hollow mockery; your prayers and hymns, your sermons and thanksgivings, with all your religious parade, and solemnity, are, to him, mere bombast, fraud, deception, impiety, and hypocrisy - a thin veil to cover up crimes which would disgrace a nation of savages.
 
Go where you may, search where you will, roam through all the monarchies and despotisms of the old world, travel through South America, search out every abuse, and when you have found the last, lay your facts by the side of the everyday practices of this nation, and you will say with me, that, for revolting barbarity and shameless hypocrisy, America reigns without a rival:
 
There is not a nation on the earth guilty of practices, more shocking and bloody, than are the people of these United States, at this very hour."&#8232;Frederick Douglass, "What to the Slave is the Fourth of July?" 5 July 1852
 

I can see that, unlike Aidan, Pericles, Agronomist, JF Aus and 579, Arjay has not taken the effort to inform himself from the 9/11 Commission Report [1] or is video version.[2]

When he does, Arjay will no doubt cease wasting our time casting such dark aspersions against those visionary leaders who have done so much to protect the world, particularly Iraq, Libya, South Sudan, Syria and Ukraine, from terror.

Footnote[s]

[1] Download http://govinfo.library.unt.edu/911/report/911Report.pdf from http://govinfo.library.unt.edu/911/report/index.htm .

[2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hgrunnLcG9Q

Back in 1964, the CIA devised the tactic of labelling anyone, who disputed the Warren Commission's finding that the lone gunman Lee Harvey Oswald murdered President John F. Kennedy, a "conspiracy theorist" in order to prevent a broad public discourse about the murder from occurring.

Fortunately, that smear did not stop Miami District Attorney Jim Garrison from attempting to prosecute one person who participated in the conspiracy to murder JFK. Oliver Stone's movie "JFK" of 1991 was based on the book "On the Tril of the Assassins", Jim Garrison's account of his efforts to seek justice.

Unfortunately, in spite of Jim Garrison's efforts, two other figures with statures similar to that of JFK, Bobby Kennedy (RFK) and Martin Luther King (MLK), were also murdered before the end of the decade. In the case of MLK, a jury trial found in 1999 that the local police and the army had conspired to murder MLK (See "US. Government Guilty of Martin Luther King's Murder" at http://www.globalresearch.ca/us-government-guilty-of-martin-luther-kings-murder-the-corporate-media-covers-it-up/5376631).

Other articles about the "conspiracy theory" smear include "Cracking The "Conspiracy Theories'" Psycholinguistic Code: The Witch Hunt against Independent Research and Analysis" (12/5/14) http://www.globalresearch.ca/cracking-conspiracy-theorys-psycholinguistic-code-the-witch-hunt-against-independent-research-and-analysis/5383108 and "The 'Conspiracy Theory' Label: Powerful Tool of Media Disinformation and Political Discourse" (1/4/14).