Ludwig,

Carry on...I believe you're nearly through to China.

"Thanks again Poirot for demonstrating your incredibly blinkered view…. and for showing how right Paul is with this statement:"

"What an incredibly hopeless way of thinking. Or I should say; of NOT thinking!"

What happened to these sentiments?

"..."people are supposed to debate things in a non personal and non derogatory manner. To stoop to personal slander or trying to take the discussion into personal territory is fundamentally against the principles of this forum"."

Hypocrite

I'm not interested in your confected "possibilities".

Harris was found guilty of crimes - violations of the law and of societal mores.

And...as is my wont...I'm fascinated from a psychological standpoint by your tactic of trying to get Paul "onside' by painting me out to be so much worse.

Paul appears to agree with my stance on the issue.

And apart from a few revolting wonks earlier in the thread - so does everyone else.

Ludwig when you say <<Kiddie-fiddlers, even at the very light end of the spectrum as with Harris, have done things that are simply irredeemable>>

That is where you are wrong, there is no light or heavy end of the spectrum. Being a pedophile is like walking off a cliff, you can't walk off a little, or a lot, for that matter, you can only walk off. A person simply by action passes a point of no return through a one way door, "Rolf Harris you are a pedophile" that is the community attitude, there is no "Rolf Harris you are a little bit of a pedophile" or "Rolf Harris you are an ex-pedophile" the last two do not exists. Hariis got fairness from the judge, to the best of his ability, in the sentencing process. Harris has now "gone" forever.

I see Ludwig is yet AGAIN resorting to direct personal abuse against forum members, simply because he's long lost the argument.

When Ludwig loses, he abuses: "Thanks again Poirot for demonstrating your incredibly blinkered view". "What an incredibly hopeless way of thinking. Or should I say of NOT thinking". Yes, Ludwig the personal abuser.

I suggest we have a special forum award, 'The Forum Personal Abuser Award'. My nomination is Ludwig. Does anyone wish to second this nomination? Should Ludwig win the award, we can list his achievement in BIG letters on the forum main page. That way new members will be immediately aware that Ludwig is the official 'Forum Abuser'.

That's a howler, Ludwig.

>>Their intolerance of what really are quite gentle and reasonable suggestions of POSSIBILITIES of different interpetations, is really quite extreme. If they expressed the same level of intolerance in relation to various other subjects, they'd be absolutely howled down for it.... in much the same way as they howling me down on this subject.<<

You have been "howled down" as a result of your own extreme intolerance of ideas with which you disagree. The image that you have of yourself - a fair-thinking, open-minded explorer of potential injustice is pure self-delusion. You opened the discussion with an impassioned appeal for clemency, on behalf of a convicted paedophile, a proven molester of little girls, and then feign bewilderment that so many people find your stance objectionable.

The fiction that you then tried to create - "hey, I'm only saying that everyone should carefully consider these POSSIBILITIES" is gossamer-thin, and cannot hide the fact that you are an unrepentant apologist for despicable behaviour. The fact that you consider groping a girl's bottom to be entirely trivial, even after hundreds of posts pointing out that it is anything but trivial, demonstrates that you still maintain a value system at odds with the bulk of the human race.

Accept the fact that you are out of step with society in this matter, and learn from it. Society does not tolerate the sexual molestation of children. You cannot simply transfer this abhorrence to other fields, and pretend they are pari passu. As you tried to do here...

>>Just think about that in relation to all manner of other offences. Littering. Speeding. Stealing, etc, etc. Why should pedophilic / child-molestation / child touching offences be viewed differently to everything else in this regard?<<

Swallow what might possibly be left of your pride, and accept that it is your reality that is out of step with the world, and not the world that is out of step with reality.

That is a good post, Pericles...beautifully articulated.

This thread has become not so much about Rolf's conviction...but more about Ludwig's curious reticence to accept that other people disagree with his stance.

Apparently he can't get his head around it.

I've seldom had occasion on OLO to be told I'm "not thinking" because I won't buy someone's outlandish hypotheses.

The reason I've hung around this thread is out of a morbid fascination for Ludwig's argument, which, contrary to societal standards, appears to be constructed on his own confected moralities - and a goodly dollop of fresh air.

<< You are in a deep hole of your own digging and with no ladder, about the only way out is to let the sides crumble in silence then slowly climb up the fallen debris. >>

So Is Mise, who dug the hole?

Was it the person who rightly and calmly made suggestions that perhaps the judge shouldn’t be held up as a saint and have his every word worshipped as gospel, and that other interpretations are indeed quite possible?

Or was it the small bunch of total intolerants who couldn’t stomach these suggestions, without launching straight into tirades of personal abuse?

I put it to you that it was the latter.

There is only a perceived ‘hole’ here on this thread. There isn’t one out there in the real world. Lots of people share my views. And I have much more faith in peoples’ opinions when I am speaking to them at length face to face than I do with this sort of correspondence on OLO.

You will recall that there were several people early in this thread who expressed similar views to me. They have rightly left, in light of low-lifers that would have hounded them if they’d hung around.

Have a look at the character of people still in this discussion. There is one of good character, there is one of a very polarised nature and quite nasty character and there are a couple of dismal personal character, who don’t respect the OLO forum rules and who just flame to the hilt.

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