Only in your imagination, Ludwig.

>>If our GDP declined by 10% while population growth stayed the same, we’d not be in a good place. But if population growth declined by 20%, we’d be in a better place than if we had an increase in GDP accompanied by the normal rate of increase in population size.<<

This goes to prove conclusively that you don't understand how GDP occurs. We have been experiencing "an increase in GDP accompanied by the normal rate of increase in population size", and our prosperity has continued to increase.

Which draws attention to the part of my previous post you chose to ignore.

>>But an ever-bigger economy, which has an ever-bigger demand for everything built into it as a fundamental element, is just going to get us NOWHERE!

Except better off, of course. [See per capita GDP for details]<<

The incontrovertible facts are that our increased population has been responsible for an increase in GDP, and when shared out amongst the entire population, an increase is also evident.

Any thoughts?

JULES/QUOTE..THE quote/ludwig<<..if population growth declined by 20%,.we’d be in a better place..than \if..we had an increase in GDP accompanied./,...by the normal rate of increase in population size.<<

perjury/note..<<..This goes to prove conclusively..>>

huh?

<<..that you don't understand how GDP occurs.>>

20 percent decline=..on the rate of growth..is still \4/5 ths higher
all growth=growth..unless..<<We have been experiencing "an increase>>GROWTH..BE IT SLIGHTLY/SLOWER GROWTH.

<<..in GDP accompanied.,.by the normal rate of increase..in population size",..and our prosperity has continued to increase.>>

just less fast/but still in the black
[unless govt malfeasance..loads us with usurious or odious criminal debt/at interest..no less..[its treason]

<<>.Which draws attention to the part
of my previous post you chose to ignore....>>But an ever-bigger economy,..which has an ever-bigger demand*?

more people dont indicate more demand/let aloner ability to meet demand

<<..for everything built into it..as a fundamental element,
is just going to get us..,NOWHERE!

Except better off, of course.>>

YES BIGGER NUMBERS SOMEHOW MEANS MORE FOR ALL OF US
YOU CAN DIVIDE A CAKE INTO INFINITY

And beyond..in theory..proffer/

<<>.[See per capita GDP for details]<<,,The incontrovertible facts are that our increased population..has been responsible for an increase in GDP,>>

not really..only that the money cost/value..has in creased economically/not necessarily FOR THE BETTER.

>>//and when shared out amongst the entire population,
an increase is also evident.Any thoughts?>>

YES A PIE CAN EASY BE CUT INTO TWO
OR HALF OF A HALF.. or even quarter of a half

BUT..THAT MEANS WE EACH GET LESSS
THE MORE WANT A BITE OF THE GOVT CASH-COW CAKE...THE LESS EACH CAN GET[UNLESS YOU GOT FIRST BITE..ON THE CHERRY/..THE SECOND BITE.. and THE CHERRY IS GONE.

Perhaps this offering from one under god will help you understand, Ludwig.

>>20 percent decline=..on the rate of growth..is still \4/5 ths higher
all growth=growth..unless..<<We have been experiencing "an increase>>GROWTH..BE IT SLIGHTLY/SLOWER GROWTH.<<

It certainly is a very close match to your own reasoning.

<< Ludwig, thanks for your contribution it makes a lot of sense to me. >>

Very good Paul.

<< This business of "growth" … can't be SUSTAINABLE! >>

Absolutely. And yet GDP indicates that growth is good and faster growth is better, end of story… with no considerations of anything else at all!

And Pericles is going to great lengths to defend GDP!! ( :>/

<< We have been experiencing "an increase in GDP accompanied by the normal rate of increase in population size", and our prosperity has continued to increase. >>

Pericles, please define ‘prosperity’. Either that or stop making preposterous assertions.

Our prosperity has not increased in the last ten years. In this time frame GDP and the whole economy increase to 250% of what it was in 2004. And yet our prosperity has NOT increased.

Are we any better off in terms of the provision of infrastructure and services? Has unemployment or homelessness or crime or all manner of other quality-of-life factors improved at all, let alone to the tune of 2.5 times as good as they were in 2004?

Has the quality of our agricultural output improved? Has the quality of the land that supports agriculture improved or declined?

Our non-renewable resource base is considerably smaller than it was a decade ago, which definitely equates to a reduction in prosperity, all else being equal.

<< This goes to prove conclusively that you don't understand how GDP occurs. >>

GDP, what’s that??

Oh…. you mean that bodgy indicator that includes a whole lot of stuff that is OBVIOUSLY neutral and thus should be included within a total which purports everything that makes it up to be entirely economically positive?

The real issue here is not your allegation that I don’t understand GDP, but your obvious lack of understanding of long-term economics, and of what economic growth is supposed to provide for us…. and indeed would if it was real. Our economic growth, in terms of achieving a supply capability that can cater for the demand and at a significantly better quality, is alas not real at all!

Again, look at infrastructure, services, homelessness, cost of living, and all manner of other things.

continued

<< Except better off, of course. >>

How about a bit of justification. Show us where infrastructure, services and any other QOL factors are significantly better, let alone 2.5 times better than ten years ago.

And tell us: if everything is so much better than it was in 04, why we are so far behind with infrastructure that Abbott has seen it as a top priority, and why are health and education services are always in the news?

<< The incontrovertible facts are that our increased population has been responsible for an increase in GDP… >>

Yes yes YES!!

But has that increase in population been responsible for a concomitant increase in the supply and quality of infrastructure and services, or has it worked diametrically against this?

So um… how does an enormous increase in GDP, which has very largely happened as a result of enormous population growth, sit with a far far less enormous improvement in all the things that economic growth is supposed to give us??

<< …and when shared out amongst the entire population, an increase is also evident. >>

An average per-capita increase actually does not mean that the average person is seeing much of an increase, if any. I think you would agree that the richer are getting rapidly richer and the poor ain’t getting much out of it at all.

And of course we are talking about a measurement (per-capita GDP) which is utterly flawed because it is based on the utterly flawed GDP indicator…. which sort of renders it rather meaningless. Actually it is much worse than meaningless – it is HIGHLY misleading.