Why is Russia the bad guy again?

Russia has a strategic interest in the Crimea as their only warm water naval port. The NATO issue that comes with Ukraine’s EU membership is provocative. Why is America stirring the pot....whom does Obama represent?

The press have not reflected factually on Russia’s claim to the region. The Crimea is a self governing province that was given to Ukraine by changing a boarder on a map. Ukraine has no historical ownership of the Crimea. In 1954 Khrushchev decreed the Crimea become part of Ukraine, a move that most Russians still see as illegitimate. The majority of the population are ethnic Russians.

This topic is primarily in relation to two topics . Firstly Ukraine owes huge bond repayments to the IMF and was offered $160 million per year for 5 years if they ran with the EU and the IMF restructure plan. Russia countered with an immediate $2 billion and $9 billion over 5 years. Why would Ukraine reject the Russian offer, issue two covers that.

Within living memory Ukraine suffered a genocide conducted by Stalinist Russia that eclipses the Germans efforts with the innocent Jewish people of Europe. The nationalist movement in Ukraine is stacked with firebrands of the ilk that worked closely with the SS during WWII. This same fanatical hatred is now re focussed on Russia so the will of the Ukraine people is to head west. The IMF and the WTO are directing the play.

Since the 1960’s the IMF and WTO have relentlessly loaned sovereign nations into debt in exchange for privatization of their economies and unrestricted access to their resources. Their loan policy is simply an instrument to implement their control, and they will go to war for control.

Sickening, our lives in the IMF’s hands.

Dear Sonofgloin,

Are you suggesting that Crimeans should sell their freedom for 30 pieces of silver?

Understandably they don't want to be ruled by Kiev, but do they truly think that life under Kremlin rule would be any better? There is their chance of a lifetime for independence and what do these fools do instead?...

As for the economic side, sure, hang all evil bankers for relentlessly forcing their loans and mortgages on innocent householders who never understood the terms, who were never ever told that they would need to repay that money one day.

I posted this link on another thread but it is appropriate here.

The Looting Of Ukraine Has Begun From

http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2014/03/06/looting-ukraine-begun/

According to a report in Kommersant-Ukraine, the finance ministry of Washington’s stooges in Kiev who are pretending to be a government has prepared an economic austerity plan that will cut Ukrainian pensions from $160 to $80 so that Western bankers who lent money to Ukraine can be repaid at the expense of Ukraine’s poor. http://www.kommersant.ua/doc/2424454 It is Greece all over again.

Before anything approaching stability and legitimacy has been obtained for the puppet government put in power by the Washington orchestrated coup against the legitimate, elected Ukraine government, the Western looters are already at work. Naive protesters who believed the propaganda that EU membership offered a better life are due to lose half of their pension by April. But this is only the beginning.

The corrupt Western media describes loans as “aid.” However, the 11 billion euros that the EU is offering Kiev is not aid. It is a loan. Moreover, it comes with many strings, including Kiev’s acceptance of an IMF austerity plan.

Caught between a rock and a hard place those poor Crimean's.
If they side with Russia (Which they have chosen it seems) They risk all the corruption from KGB oligarchs.
If they side with the EU, they risk being ruled by unelected, corrupt oligarchs in Brussels and turned into another Greece.
If they go for independence they'll be next on the list of nations to be re-educated in Central bank, IMF, BIS control, become another Greece anyway and not know which bunch of corrupt oligarchs will rule them.

I think they made the right decision.

< As for the economic side, sure, hang all evil bankers for relentlessly forcing their loans and mortgages on innocent householders who never understood the terms, who were never ever told that they would need to repay that money one day. >

If only it were that simple, Yuyutsu. It's true that people accept their loans. But what they don't accept and agree to, is having their money manipulated up the wahzoo so that they can no longer afford to pay back those loans! Destroying peoples lives seems to be the banksters/politicians favourite past-time!

The world will never improve until the last bankster is hung with the entrails of the last politician!

Dear Mustard,

<<But what they don't accept and agree to, is having their money manipulated up the wahzoo so that they can no longer afford to pay back those loans!>>

Would you care to explain how this works?

What I can observe, is many people who buy houses much better than mine, on mortgages. Then I see them having the air-conditioner working all night with the windows and doors wide open - some even build swimming-pools in their back-yard while still paying their mortgage. Others buy new 4WD cars on loans, well beyond their means while I retain my old sedan-car (not only for cost-saving, I also prefer older cars). I also would have loved to have swimming-pool in my backyard, or at least a Jacuzzi, but no - instead I live within my means, so I have gradually saved, first for my house then for my old age and never asked anyone for a loan.

I say the reason they cannot afford to pay back their loans is that they are spoiled rotten!

Yuyutsu - I could be wrong here but what I think he is eluding to is the IMF tactic of forcing countries to devalue there currency, thus making it easier for western corporations to buy assets cheap and forcing the country to pay back far more than they got because of the devalued currency thus keeping them poor virtually forever.

Dear Philip,

I don't know myself what is the agreement between IMF and Ukraine: if indeed the IMF forces a country to devalue its currency and that's not part of the pre-agreed conditions, then it is dishonest and that country need not repay its debt. If however they agreed to it, then they need to keep their side of the deal.

To begin with, no country should accept such harsh conditions - instead, if such demands are made, then they should go it alone, frugally but independently on their own resources, forgetting about the rest of the world and not even recognising foreign bodies as legal entities capable of ownership.

Australia too has all the natural resources it needs, so even if we don't owe the IMF any money, it would be a good idea for us to do the same, because where the world is heading is not a good place to be.

The whole thing has the smell of Hitler's Sudetenland invasion and the
seizure of parts of Georgia.
Be wary of such heads of state getting a taste for such easy solutions.

I never heard any reports of the then opposition or the now government
of the Ukraine stating that Russia would lose its rights to its Crimea bases.
I think the upshot will be that the Crimea will become part of Russia
and the Ukraine will turn west.

Yuyutsu>>Are you suggesting that Crimeans should sell their freedom for 30 pieces of silver?<<

Y, my observation is of the agenda being multi level, and none of the levels have anything to do with the betterment or prosperity of the Ukrainians. As I mentioned the Ukrainians do have a huge historic grievance with Russia.....but Stalinist Russia like Mao’s China murdered millions of their own people and Ukraine probably suffered the most during the genocide by starvation of the 1930’s.

But who do they run with...as Philips link astutely mirrors, the Ukraine will be raped by the west...used up and spat out. The Russians share a boarder and it is in Russia’s interest that Ukraine not become thy next Greece. This is not about Ukraine; it is about the IMF and NATO getting back at Russia.

I am not defending Putin or the oligarchs of the post USSR Russia, but they certainly are not going to bow to the IMF and the WTO.....they are like a great white hope.....and I also see China as the great yellow hope for the same reasons.

They have denationalized the first world.....but Russia and China are not as stupid as the west, they want to keep their gene pool and sovereignty....not give it up to a small group of world rulers who control the globe from suites in banking institutions in Europe

RawMustard>>The world will never improve until the last bankster is hung with the entrails of the last politician!<<

RM, the household I grew up in was grass roots left with a fair slice of Trotsky thrown in. So I always believed the financiers ran the lot, and that they had a new world order dream in place early in their power grab.

But I honestly never believed that they would tie up governments and populations under the shackle of generational debt before the nobody’s of the world uniformly shouted for change.....but they have. They planned to dumb down the populous and give them mindless non productive media to dull their senses, and they have.

Bloody pollies RM, useless as nipples on men, don’t matter which side you vote for you get sell outs to the IMF and WTO...we got no friends....we’re orphans.

sonofgloin - Quote "They planned to dumb down the populous and give them mindless non productive media to dull their senses, and they have."

Funny you should say that, that was how Rome controlled the population but it was termed something like give them bread and circus.

Yuyutsu - Just check on any country the IMF have given money to try to find some that have prospered because of it then check on how many have been ruined by it or are at the mercy of the International bankers.

Dear Sonofgloin,

You only confirm what I wrote, that anyone who is able should stay away from all big powers. While some are unable because they cannot withstand the military machines of the big powers, if all it takes is to tighten one's belt economically, then it's most worthwhile to do so.

Crimeans could, until last week, have opted for independence without inviting the Russians. They would still continue to host the Russian fleet and even benefit from it economically without becoming part of Russia itself. Now it is sadly, too late!

Ukraine will probably be unable to hold its eastern regions for long, but its army is strong enough to deter the Russians from invading its west - it's not that the Russians couldn't take over by force, but their casualties would be too high and I don't believe they would risk using nukes at this time.

Dear Philip,

<<Yuyutsu - Just check on any country the IMF have given money to try to find some that have prospered because of it then check on how many have been ruined by it or are at the mercy of the International bankers.>>

The question is which is cause and which is effect: is it the IMF which ruined them, or were they already so ruined that they were willing to beg help even from the devil?

Worthwhile article on Putin and Western leaders actions etc. + link to speech.

Personally Putin is no angel and has lots of blood on his hands but in this instance his diplomacy is by far better than the idiot western puppets.

http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2014/03/10/putin-speaks/

ou can read an English translation of Vladimir Putin’s March 4 press conference here:
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article37889.htm

Yuyutsu>> You only confirm what I wrote, that anyone who is able should stay away from all big powers. While some are unable because they cannot withstand the military machines of the big powers,<<

Y. yes you should not play with fire, but if fire is the only game in town, you are compelled.

This issue is not about territorial claims by way of arms. The agenda is to “own” the nation and the people by way of controlling the purse strings. I consider this strategy by the European Banking Cartel akin to the old neutron bomb...it devastates cell structures but leaves bricks and mortar untouched. The bank wants the assets of the broken Ukraine and in particular a stake in the say of the Ukrainian land that the Russian gas pipes to Europe cross over., ..........and NATO wants to stick it to the Ruskies on their own front door. Both powers ie Russia and the IMF are bastards....but Russia no longer has plans to rule the world....the IMF does.

As I said the Russians are not the bad guys regarding the Crimea . In1993, the Crimean parliament established the post of President of Crimea and wrote a constitution.... but in 1995, the parliament of Ukraine intervened, scrapping the Crimean Constitution and removing Yuriy Meshkov (the President) along with his office for his actions in promoting integration with Russia.

Twenty years ago the Crimea wanted to integrate with Russia, but the Ukraine military stopped it, so the will of the Crimea people to integrate with the Russian state is not new....and it certainly is not a Russian instigated takeover as the western press spins to us.

Thanks for the links Phil...yeah Putin has a no spin credibility that has evaded American presidents since the 1960's. That does not mean he will not lie through his teeth but the matter of fact dissection of the subject leads you to believe he understands what he is saying rather than regurgitating script from a teleprompter from a teleprompter.

Just on speaking your own mind....when laptops were new I was in front of an executive defending a business transaction, one senior GM and a half a dozen execs and lawyers each in their early thirties. Everyone had a lap top opened and typed continuously, excepting the GM. As the florid discussion went on between myself and the GM I marvelled at how well he was across the subject, in its entirety....then I realized he was being fed the responses......never happened to before, and has never happened since.