Listening to Bill Shorten today, on unemployment benefits, I think this is one policy labor has the right approach on.

He says, in reply to those struggling to survive on the dole, "we prefer to offer increased skills traing and child support",as opposed to increased payments.

It's the age old saying, "you can hand a man a fish and he will eat tonight, but teach him to fish and he will eat forever".

What I would say to Mr Shorten though, with regards to child care, this should only be available for those attending interviews or training, and, don't forget working parents, who, by their very actions are helping to support those who seek work.

Of cause they will have to watch this closely, as many are poised to loose thier jobs, should minimg continue to head south.

I do not think unemployment is to be a problem in the next few years.
But can see Shortens point.
I too see the other side, an in coming Liberal Government, as is the case with this one, understands we must look at costs.
Cuts will come post election.
Here I find trouble, from my opponents and fellow travelers.
I have no doubt, even evidence,SOME are too comfortable on welfare.
I am not proposing we end welfare, but that we get a return for our investment.
Current moves to sell off and contract out every thing are ignorant.
Proper leadership and management can fix anything.
In areas of high long term unemployed we should make full time jobs without comes of benefit to all.
IF it works why not all unemployment to be treated this way.
In the end, however you see it, who wants to forever feed the extremely work shy?

In the latest unemployment figures, the number in work went up, and the number of job seekers went up also. That says there is a group of job seekers out there that are not sure if they need to work or not. Probably full time housewives, and self funded retirees.
Those sort of figures makes it hard to get an exact number of job seekers there is.
163,500 Jobs available at the end of September.
The govt is still bringing in skilled workers on special visas, for mining position's.

Supplying housing,food, clothing and necessities along with a little cash would be better than just giving cash. To much Government money goes on booze, cigerettes and gambling. The kids are the ones who suffer.

The govt is still bringing in skilled workers on special visas, for mining position's.
579.
Who are you thinking of employing instead ? Australian Uni Graduates who can't hold a saw or a hammer ? Since apprenticeships were done away with we've been on a downward spiral. The only way out to get some brains back into blue collar jobs is by getting workers from overseas.

Government money
runner,
Government money ?? What happens to our taxes ?

Belly said;
In areas of high long term unemployed we should make full time jobs
without comes of benefit to all.

If an area has long time unemployment, it may mean that there is no
economic need for work to be done in the area.
In those circumstances, then only activities such as call centres
would be viable.

I think that problem is unsolvable, and about all could be done is to
train for work in such places in mining and arrange for them to travel
to the work.

Bazz I had no intention of posting here again, I come back out of respect for you.
Honesty being better than untruth, the views of runner and Indy are blind.
Well Bazz a truth, some council jobs, in some areas all of them, have always been to create jobs for folk who would not get one.
And to prop up rural areas.
Rail ,roads, a host of government jobs, remember the term decentralization?
Still vital we do not forget the non coastal parts of this country.
You may chose not to believe it, but as ganger and union delegate, I saw workers who should have been sacked, asked for one to be, the culture of job creation over productivity is dead.
But if it was my task to re birth it, first act would be contracting out the management roles.
They not the workers, are the problem.
I truly think, privatization invites CORRUPTION and price increases, product failure.
And that country jobs not lifetime dole is an answer.
INSTANT BENEFITS include far less fraud as cash and dole workers leave or get caught.

Belly,
So you reckon my views are blind because we can't get an Australian apprentice or Tradesman ?

Belly I can not agree with your idea of councils employing the incompetent. We have commonwealth systems for supporting the unemployable, this is not a council function.

My rates have gone from something just over $300 dollars to over $2200 a year, in the almost 20 years I have owned this property, that's 700%, & totally ridiculous. Council rates have gone up at a faster rate, than anything else.

For this I get a garbage service none of us wanted, & the pot holes in the single car wide road patched about once every 5 years.

It is bad enough that councils are the most inefficient form of government, with empire building & union control causing these huge increases, without trying to make then a second string welfare system.

I don't know how you find your rate bill, but along with other fixed costs, like electricity, insurance & automotive costs, I am finding a large reduction in my discretionary spending.

I would love a Campbell Newman to do a hatchet job through our council, & start bringing the ridiculous costs down.

I agree that many apprenticeships today are a waste of time and, many so called 'tradesmen' having completed a so called apprenticeship are simply under skilled, yet expect to be paid a fair days pay, for a poor days work.

This in my view has resulted from a change in our traing, which occurred back in the late 80's to mid 90's, whereby college blocks were replaced by on the job

Nowadays, many of the trainers/bosses are a product of this poor training system.

Using butchery as an example, I can employ an apprentice, show them how to break a lamb, pig, make mince, sausage etc and sign them off, even if they only do these tasks once during their term.

Breaking beef is now an extra course and, given all courses cost money, many don't bother.

Self assessment is one experiment that has gone wrong in my view.

BTW, the reason many bosses rush apprentices through is money, as they get incentives to train, but only enough to pass the required level.

I had very few apprentices complete their time with me, as most left as they said I was too hard on them.

But the ones who stuck it out, two are managers and one is a millionaire from running his own shop.

I was fortunate enough to be taught by an old school boss and I carried that skill set on.

Using Rehctub's logic , and the logic of the other far right wingers here, we should immediately reduce all old age pensions to $240 per week. We should then give them skills training so they won't be a burden on us.

Or, do ya'll have double standards regarding this?

Let me tell you some truths.
I never agreed with the old way of job creation, Queensland held those country jobs in councils and roads in trust.
For cane farmers and such.
After floods PORK BARRELING was its name.
I propose a CHANGE, that work out comes are the driver, and that CHANGE in welfare be a saving.
Now, UNBELIEVABLE? sorry true too, a person changed with letting a contract, in fact all contracts for LABOR HIRE grants it to his sisters firm.
When questioned leaves, to work for? his sister!
Such is the NSW RTA!
I want an end to corruption.
A job not dole, if government makes any form of job we pay in the end,council rates are separate and could be subsidized by federal funds.
We must one day look for better out comes for welfare not starving folk to death.
And am sure even better ideas are out there, even from contributors here.
In the end I think a job is better than sit down money, for the community and the receiver.

DiamondPete,
As is your standard you're dribbling nonsense again. Reducing the pension ? You mean reducing the value of everything you've paid for all your life ? Because you don't know I'll tell you now. Pensioners have already paid that money during their working life & yes it was a working life unlike yours which by the sounds of it is a mere hanging in till payday. Get a life. Ah, & a proper job too while you're at it !

work for his sister ?
Belly,
Yes, just like paying the Unions for the right to work. You're right, all extremely hypocritical !

Individual, you're wrong. Old age pensioners have NOT "already paid that money" that they are living on. The ONLY people who have "already paid that money" are self funded retirees, not on the old age pension, who have made their "own" contributions to their superannuation pensions (separate from the "GOVERNMENT" 9% contributions).

Therefore I was correct .... you right wingers have complete and total double standards when it comes to old age pensioners on the old age pension (who live off "OUR" taxes, the taxes of people currently working) and people receiving unemployment benefits.

Your far right wing ideology = double standards.

DP read the gents reply to me.
Can you see how he got to unions? I am an ex union official.
We, you I every one, must understand, it is the best he can produce.
Find me, in this thread alone, a post that is not purely an insult.
Find me one related to this thread and it will not have his name under it.
Not all who oppose our views are right wing extremists.
Some would not understand their left from the right wing.

NOT "already paid that money"
DiamondPete,
Perhaps it was all before your time but Belly will remeber when your taxes included a component for the pension. Super was always a voluntary system. It was Labor who made Super compulsory. In my opinion this was an extremely good move by Labor but unfortunately their only good move.

How about we teach our own people to fish first.

Almost half of all immigrants (around 60,000 a year) are not "skilled".
These people are no doubt filling "unskilled" jobs Australians could do.
Don't tell me we need to "skill" unemployed Australians, while accepting 60,000 unskilled immigrants every year.

Governments already provide public housing, the benefits of which are debatable.

The gov continues supporting stupid look-busy programs like Work For The Dole, which often serve no useful purpose for the unemployed, but help the subsidized enterprise avoid paying salaried workers.
Why pay workers when you can get them for free?