What is Labor hiding, the reason I ask the question is now within 2 weeks 3 boatloads of refugees in Indonesian waters have been transported to Australia the latest today was approx 50 km from Indonesian land. So another between 130 and 180 refugees get to jump the Que.
This is a very dangerous precedent because now all the smugglers have to do is get 50 KM from land declare they are in trouble and they will be picked up by the Australian navy and transported to Australia. This latest one defies any rational explanation, the boat was less than 50Km from Indonesia and heading back to Indonesia not to Christmas Island 370km away.
Note also Indonesia was in surplus in 2011 by $5,704,000,000 But Australia was BILLION of dollars in debt yet we are giving them more aircraft and communications equipment etc.
Why do we even keep the navy there, why can't Indonesia rescue people less than 50KM away.

I share your abject disgust, Philip.

Before we get too disgusted - lets first
get the facts. The following link may help:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/huff-wires/20120704/as-australia-asylum-seekers/

Thanks Lexi. But how can I not be disgusted by this?

Any thinking person, except perhaps Sara Hanson-Young and Marilyn Shepherd, would be heartily sickened by the whole onshore asylum-seeking debacle.

How can our government not have dealt with it by now??

How could that complete #$@#%^ of a PM, K Rudd, have opened up this whole saga again, after it had been dealt with by Howard?

How…… on……. earth……. did that happen?? ?? ?? ??

That boat more than likely would not have continued except they sent a distress message if the Australian navy boats was not sitting next to them they would have gone back as the Indonesian navy would not escort them to a 4 star luxury holiday at taxpayer expense.
The other 2 boats that sank were in Indonesian waters but Australian boats got there first all survivors transported to Australia. 1 of them even on a chartered 737 plane.
Border protection is a joke border taxi service is a more appropriate definition.
It is costing Million to provide this taxi service in the disguise of border protection.

Yes, & the fool woman thinks that once we get used to her rip off carbon dioxide tax, all will be forgiven.

One has to start to think that she is well aware we are going to kick her out so hard her eyes will water, & she is there for setting us up with as much future trouble as she possibly can.

If we find her guilty of treason, would that cancel the huge pension we are going to be paying the witch after we chuck her out. She must be close to having a case to answer now.

Lexi while you and I do not agree in this area I too can not cop the blame Labor mob.
However others will.
Consider the unsaid claims being made here.
It seems, even to me, the criminals have told boats to leave, or nearly leave Indonesian waters.
In boats even more unsea worthy.
Then call for help! knowing it has to be from us.
People will, like it or not, perceive Labor is soft on refugees.
We, Labor will suffer, very badly, because of it.
But unwanted as it is, the truth is we can do little.
We dare not turn them around, we must respond and save lives.
Folk here forget we have international visitors on the site, we poorly represent our country by saying we should force another country to act in a way they do not wish to.
We can, we should, right now,give that country more existing ships,to be placed there, in the center of the hole in the dam.
In return we have the right to ask they be returned before entering international waters.
Greens, this morning, condemn some to death.
Labor must replace its leader will do so before the end of August.
Abbott's amendments will be a start to saying if we must be hard harsh to stop deaths so be it.
This issue is crushing my party, assisted by some who unknowingly are seeing Abbott not us is going to be in charge of this.
And both us and the greens will have no say from opposition, the place we are headed with out changes

So now we have given the people smugglers a new game plan.

Get the boat a few nautical miles off the Java coast, call OZ search & rescue on your mobile, refuse to turn back & wait for warship to come & collect them.

It means that the smugglers can now deliver four or five boat loads in the time it previously took them to make one trip.

Julia if you cannot fix this –CALL AN ELECTION AND LET SOMEONE ELSE HAVE A GO!

Give it another 5 boats & the sixth one will be towed off an indonesian wharf by an australian Navy ship. Don't blame the PM, blame her moron supporters.
It's just getting easier by the boat load to come here. What are we having a Customs Department for ? Spend squillions to stop some chinese grandmother to bring in a chilli ?
Get real, get rid of the morons in authority. Publish the names of individual bureaucrats who fail to protect this Nation. Sack them or severely demote them. Then and only then can we hope of reversing this trend. A genuine visitor can't get a visa yet here we let questionable characters in by the boat load.

Also we are being lied to in the most blatant way.
The govt is telling us that the Indonesian and Australian Navies and
emergency management organisations do not have compatible
communications equipment.

Absolute rubbish. Of course they all have Marine VHF and HF equipment !
We know this because the Indonesians broadcast for the nearest ships to
go to the location of the boat.

Why the lies ? Are they trying to manufacture excuses for allowing
the Aus Navy to take the boat passengers to Christmas Island ?

This one incident has convinced me that the whole business is a cover
to import all the illegals in Indonesia to Australia.
There can be no other explanation.

"individual" Good point the TV show "border security" on it if someone declares they have a criminal conviction the immigration and airport manager do a big song and dance about how they have to protect the rights and safety of Australians, which I agree with.
But the reality is different when someone turns up on a boat with no documents and they even claim to come from a different country than they really come from. We really do not know who they are Example Cap't Emad
Where was this great protection when the refugee sexually assaulted 5 girls at the Darwin pool or the girl assaulted on the train in SA there are more cases just look them up.

This border protection has now decended into a complete farse. Next we will see us chartering aircraft to fly the illegals here.

A total debarcle caused by Rudd.

We have seen them overload the old boats to ridulas levels. We have seen them sabotage the boats so we have to pick them up. We have seen them hyjack the 'Tampa' to get to Aus. They even dropped some of their kids overboard to intimidate us. We gave in about the 'Oceanic Viking' incident, Now we are performing escort duty. Free flights next?

They are playing us like a violin, we are fools.

I am now of the belief that if an armed invading force approached, this government would give them occupation, just like the French did during WW11, as long as this mob remained as a puppet government. The government actually wants this country to fail. Brown was right they are after a single world government where we get no say over our own country.

I am absolutely disgusted. What did our forebears make all those sacrifices for.

<<the TV show "border security" on it if someone declares they have a criminal conviction the immigration and airport manager do a big song and dance about how they have to protect the rights and safety of Australians>>

But it seems every time ASIO finds an “asylum seeker” to be a security risk it’s the refugee industry that does the big song and dance telling us how unjust it all is.

However, the real weakness/fault is this – and it applies equally to BOTH Labor & Liberal administrations --even when our processes find fault with the claimants.It is highly likely that despite all the breast-beating and noise on our part. They will not be expelled and they will not be held in indefinite detention.But secretly and slyly be released into the community after all the attention has gone elsewhere.

As appears will be the case with the “failed” Iranian “asylum seekers” –see below:
“More than 40 per cent of asylum seekers who arrived by boat in the past year were Iranians and, of the ones assessed, about two-thirds have had their application for refugee status rejected…Asked if releasing failed asylum seekers into the community was an option, Mr Bowen said: 'Yeah. And that would be on some sort of bridging visa which would be to say, 'when we are able to return you to Iran, then you would be returned'."[ Now,if you believe the last bit about them being returned to Iran “when we are able” you’ll believe in fairies at the bottom of garden!]
http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/more-than-a-thousand-iranians-risk-languishing-for-years-in-detention/story-e6freuy9-1226180501361

So in the end they all get what they sought --BY DEFAULT
[and, we wonder why we can't stop the boats!]

As far as I understand this current situation Australia
is working with Indonesia's Maritime Search and Rescue
agency to help. Initially this particular boat with
180 people on board was about 50 nautical miles (80
kilometeres) South West of Panaitan - a small island of the
western end of the main Java island. However by the afternoon
it had drifted 130 kilometeres of Christmas Island.

Indonesian planes and navy ships found it very difficult
to assist due to bad weather conditions and very rough seas
off Indonesia. They finally returned home as the small boat
moved closer to Christmas Island and the Australian Navy
responded by keeping an eye on the boat after their distress
call. All ships according to Maritime law are obligated to
respond to distress calls.

We can criticise and finger point and be disgusted as much as
we like. However no matter which government is in power they
will have to end up working with Indonesia to resolve this
regional problem. This is a complex issue and working with
one's neighbours it would seem - should be part of the
solution to this problem. The Prime Minister has no choice
in this matter. And neither would the Opposition - were they
to win the next election. The problem is not about to go
away any time soon.

Lexi you are wrong the Prime Minister has a choice an easy one some people may not like it.
As long as we keep our navy and planes right next to Indonesia they will always used as a taxi service but if they are withdrawn and Indonesia is left to look after their own waters they will keep coming'
They will now call Australia as soon as they get a little way of land.
I believe that boat would have turned around had it not had our boats next to it.
Indonesia do not want to stop them, do you honestly think in Indonesia you could congregate up to 180 foreigners and the police don't know.
I also believe they do not want to rescue them because then they would have to take them back to Indonesia.

After Australia screwed over Indonesia with the stupid ban on live cattle exports, this is Indonesia's pay back. Today the People smugglers just have to push out from land and call for the Australian valet service.

This problem will be sorted out within 6 months of a Coalition government assuming power.

Corrected version
Lexi you are wrong the Prime Minister has a choice an easy one some people may not like it.
As long as we keep our navy and planes right next to Indonesia they will always be used as a taxi service, but if they are withdrawn and Indonesia is left to look after their own waters that may stop some coming.
We pay million to keep the navy and planes their but they do nothing but provide an incentive to try.
They will now call Australia as soon as they get a little way of land.
I believe that boat would have turned around had it not had our boats next to it.
Indonesia do not want to stop them, do you honestly think in Indonesia you could congregate up to 180 foreigners and the police don't know.
I also believe they do not want to rescue them because then they would have to take them back to Indonesia.

Dear Philip,

What I do know is that Parliament voted to give
a compromise solution a chance for 12 months.
Even though this was passed in the House of Reps,
the Senate led by the Coalition and the Greens vetoed
this attempt. Now that is something that should indeed
disgust us all!

With the visit
of Indonesia's President to Australia the Government
is apparently trying to work towards resolving this
problem regionally. Therefore Australia is working
with Indonesia's Maritime Search and Rescue Agency.
I do believe that bad weather and
very rough seas did contribute to the failed rescue
attempts in this case.

cont'd ...

The following link may help:

http://news.smh.com.au/breaking-news-national/rough-seas-hamper-rescue-of-asylum-boat-20120704-21g3g.html

Thanks to the Coalition and the Greens - the Government
failed last week to pass laws that would have restored the
Government's power to send asylum seekers to other countries
for processing.

Lexi - again you are wrong you said " I do believe that bad weather and
very rough seas did contribute to the failed rescue attempts in this case" BUT Quote "HMAS Wollongong found the boat intact and continuing under its own power to Christmas Island" In other words they called to get an escort at the time of the call there was nothing wrong with the boat. WE should not attend let Indonesia look after them as long as we keep turning up they will keep coming. Our navy went approx 370KM but Indonesia could not even go 50KM.

Lexi, you are far more naive than I had previously thought.
You have been totally hoodwinked by your attachment to the Labour Party.
Indonesia does not want us to have a successful border system.
They want to unload as many as possible of their unwanted illegals onto us.

What I would do is like 000 does, ask their location and then switch
them through to Indonesian S&R.

That is the proper procedure. At present the Australian government is
in breach of international treaty by stepping into Indonesian responsibilities.
It is a lie that Indonesia does not have compatible communications.
We should not get involved unless requested by Indonesia S&R.
We should not accept that Indonesia cannot participate.
They cannot refuse re entry of vessels towed back.
If our vessels left it to an Indonesian request to intervene there
could be no argument about returning the passengers and or the vessel.

Bear in mind that Indonesian rescue area extends almost to Christmas Island.

Dear Philip and Bazz,

If I'm naive as you guys seem to think - so be it.
All I know is the Coalition and the Greens had a
chance to put their money where their mouths are
and they blew it. Now blaming the Government for
trying to salvage what's left is not going to
achieve anything constructive.

I've just heard the news on ABC Radio, apparently the government has announced the AFP will be forming a special squad of circa 200 personnel to engage in S & R and other duties specific to the boat people.

Well, 'strike me pink', what'll that prove ! Unleash these big tough AFP blokes on these poor, hapless refugees. Nothing will solve this issue...permenantly, if we use methods like these.

Sure, they could reintroduce Temporary Protection Visas, reopen Nauru, perhaps, that'll be a reasonable, interim measure.

But, what we do need though, is a permanent fix, if we're ever going to preserve the integrity of our borders.

And sending in this so called crack squad of 'plastic police' will do nothing ! Look at the mess they've created with that Capt. 'whatever his name is, the alleged people smuggler, with the AFP bleating something to the effect '...we didn't have enough to prevent him from leaving...'

Gee, are these blokes coppers or not !! What about the good ol' 'Tarpaulin' Act... 'it covers everything'! Any copper worth his salt could've done something proactive to stop this peanut from fleeing the country. The ming 'boggles'.

The only way to fix this problem for good, is to create an effective regional response - To do that, we need an immensly strong co-op with the Indonesian Government. If not, all other measures will in time, surely fail.

We must seek a strong REGIONAL RESPONSE, if we ever hope to halt these dreadful people smuggling crimes.

Lexi,

If the government really wanted off shore processing they could have accepted the Coalition's amendments and stopped most of the boats 6 months ago. That they refused based on pride is shameful.

The solution is easy do what the UN do in Africa. When they arrive they get a tent and every few days some food THAT IS ALL. Watch how quickly they stop coming.
What do we give - air conditioned housing, smokes, food, internet, doctors, phones, plasma TV's, money, lawyers, refugee advocates, preferential housing and welfare payments for life to name a few, ALL for nothing they have done nothing for Australia.

The sad thing is they will get here tell us what we are doing isnt what they have been promised by their tour guides and burn or destroy what we have given them. All this while Australians carnt get housing or help from this so called government. Open up the centres for the public and send these world tourists back.

Dear Shadow Minister,

What Mr Abbott offered was to increase the intake
of asylum seekers to 20,000. And he wanted the
compromise that was being considered by Parliament
to have off-shore processing only in countries
that have signed the Refugee Agreement. This was
simply a ploy to obstruct the government. Mr Abbott
knows very well that he's not in Government and is
in no position to increase the numbers of asylum
seekers. And Nauru was not a signatory to the
Refugee Agreement the entire time of the Pacific
Solution. To suddenly be concerned about asylum
seekers on "Humanitarian Grounds," is laughable
and hypocritical.

Hehe, these people smugglers are showing up the Australians, for
the suckers that they really are.

50 miles ? They might even get their boats back for the next load
and of course the crew, not being in Australian waters, cannot be
arrested. Load after load, with little risk and the Aussies
will fall for it.

What a bunch of suckers, this country has become.

and it applies equally to BOTH Labor & Liberal administrations
SPQR,
I have to bail you up on this one. Yes it does happen under either admin but only because the Public Service is always Labor saturated even when the Liberals are in.
When we get a conservative administration we must change the key people in the Public Service also. Otherwise the whole show is a waste of time. How many more times does it need to be proven ?

Lexi, Nauru has undertaken to sign up to the treaty.
I find it hard to believe that someone who seems to be as well up on
current affairs as yourself did not know that.
Or did it just not suit your argument ?

Love your post o sung wu!

It is very good to get an ex-copper’s perspective on this stuff.

Cheers.

Lexi,

Juliar lied again. She said that the coalition hadn't moved an inch. They had offered to increase the intake and drop the demand for TPVs. However what they were not prepared to do was stoop to the complete abandonment of human rights that was the Malaysian solution which is why the high court banned it. While Nauru was not perfect, it was much better than abandoning children in Malaysia.

It is starting to look to me as if the navy, & the Immigration department have orders to get as many boat people in as possible.

After all, with the ongoing arguments, the boaties are likely to all be Labor voters, expecting to get people in, as long as Labor is in government.

So it appears that our Julia to be playing yet another lying little game with us.

I am going to enjoy voting, for the first time ever, at the next election.

Yeah Hasbeen, I’ve had similar thoughts.

What on earth are they really doing?

They could have stopped the boats if they’d wanted to.

What was really behind Rudd’s opening up of this whole issue again?

He couldn’t have made that despicable decision alone. He would have to have had the support of his closest allies, including Gillard, if not the wider support of his party as well.

Do they actually really want asylum seekers to come here, in as large numbers as possible, because they’d vote Labor?

But they can’t vote until they are Australian citizens, surely!

Hmmmmmmmm.

.
Now Haz it is really late. Go to bed for goodness sake!

Dear Bazz,

Nauru wasn't a signatory at the time of the
Pacific Solution was the point being made.

Dear Shadow Minister,

Crying over a small child in Parliament -
being unaccompanied -
while 90 die at sea and you have the power to
try to put a stop to it at least for 12 months
to see if a compromise works - is at best -
total hypocrisy and at worst - a disgrace!

The refugees should be sent to live with Kevin Rudd as he dismantled the Pacific solution which stopped them coming. His actions here have made him a tragedy for Australia. The high court should be disregarded and legislated out of the equation. The crocodile tears shed in federal parliament are worthy of an Oscar, tears shed for the media are not surely not worthy of our democracy.

However by the afternoon it had drifted 130 kilometeres of Christmas Island.
Lexi,
I'm no seasoned mariner but I do have a boat in which I do some extended cruising. I have never heard of any vessel drifting that much into the prevailing wind.

Remember who it was that decided break convention in 2001 and to play this particular (race inspired) card for immediate electoral advantage in the first place?

It was really only about votes back then and still is.

I said way back then that this particular genie will never be put back into its bottle and will open us up to some real ugliness in our society.

The real tragedy is the fact that we've been having these discussions for 10 years.

Welcome to 21st century Australia.

discussions for 10 years.
Wobbles,
And who was it who ran down Pauline Hanson ? All of the major parties. If only she'd team up with Bob Katter we might still get one more chance but I the stupidity of the educated will present a huge hurdle.

Lexi,

You should be ashamed, crying crocodile tears over the dead women and children when Labor has had years to recognise that their open doors policy isn't working, and the same time to put back the policies that worked.

Under the Pacific solution the detention centre was managed solely by Australia meeting all the conditions of the detention camps that thousands inhabit in Australia today. As the high court recognised, this was far preferable to sending children unaccompanied to fend for themselves in Malaysia and be beaten and raped by the roaming militias is an abomination.

To try and equate the two situations is disgusting. The Malaysian solution is worse than anything the pacific solution had to offer, and for a so called bleeding heart to be even considering it shows how hollow your morals are. The Labor party has lost any claim to be the compassionate party.

Shame, Lexi, shame on you!

If you rightly assume there are no children or genuine asylum-seekers on-board the unsafe boat you're forcing back to compassionate, caring, non-signatory Indonesia, it's the far more humane thing to do.

Carrying on as if the Malaysian swap involves sending children to mandatory beating and rape is shrill hyperbole. I believe that the UN may well bless the arrangement given the right safe-guards as occurred with non-signatory Nauru in the past, especially if Australia greatly raises its refuge intake within an expanded total immigration limit.

LF,

The guarantees are worthless, the vast majority of asylum seekers are processed and released into the community with no financial support or physical protection to fend for themselves.

Seriously what protection have they got against the Xenophobic militia?

Shadow Minister You are so wrong, what you say is a joke.
1) the refugees are released to the care of the charities, approx 1 year ago the Government was going to release a lot of them the charities said to the Government to help them we will need "A LOT OF MONEY" that is taxpayer money.
2) By having the charities look after them the real cost can be HIDDEN from the people and they can be given more than people on Government welfare or the dole and we will not know.
3) Because the money is given to the charities Government can say we are not giving it to them.
4) I would love to see the real cost when you consider navy air force customs AF Police all the bureaucrats all the freebees etc it will be many BILLIONS of dollars more than we are told.
Misc note in around 2003 the head of the American Red Cross had a salary of over 3 million dollars, what are the bosses of our so called charities getting, subsidized by the taxpayers.

Dear Shadow Minister,

If we want to stop the boats once and for all
this is the way to do it:

http://newmatilda.com/2012/07/05/stop-boats-once-and-all

@Lexi,

I’ve been wondering when Lexi would get around to throwing in another New Matilda link …I mean, it must be at least two days since the last one.

So let’s digest its deep wisdom.

The first thing you’ll notice is this statement:
<<How blissful it must be right now to live in Europe or America or China, free from the pressure of waves of boat people>>

Now of course Ben is being satirical – he after-all listed as NM’s “resident satirist”!

But Ben is doing something else as well, he is exhibiting his ignorance of world affairs.


1) “America” includes Mexico and places like Honduras, Belize, Costa Rica, Guatemala, El Salvador& Nicaragua And these places are not big attractors of illegal immigrants –in fact few want to go to the aforementioned at all, UNLESS, they are seeking to use such localities as staging points to sneak into the good old US of A.
2) And “China” has no illegals –boat people or otherwise. Let me correct myself there, they had a small issue during/after the Indochinese war when they did receive numbers of ethnic Chinese. But that seems to have dried up . Maybe because they said “ Yes we will grant you asylum BUT you must go and live in the boondocks.There’ll be no living it up in Guangzhou City” –strangely enough, a short time thereafter the flow on asylum seekers to China dried up!

So unbeknown to Ben, he has actually proved the oppositions point . If you are a affluent nation with generous welfare and a namby-pamby immigration policies you will attract hordes of opportunist masquerading as “asylum seekers”. But if you are a poor country or one that strongly defends its border you will attract few permanent interlopers … they ‘ll be just passing through on their way to *greener* climes .

Phillip S,
This is something I've long had an interest in but have never been able to come up with anything more than anecdotal evidence in support of my suspicions.
I've heard stories of this sort of thing going on in the U.K, the "refugees" are asked to pay a monthly fee to their landlord as "rent", in return the landlord provides a furnished home with internet access and all mod cons essentially at a loss then he submits a bill to their "handlers", adds a margin on top, the tab is picked up by "NGO's" who in turn mark up the account and have their expenses reimbursed by the state.
Other issues aside this "refugee" business involves hideous amounts of money and great secrecy which are the basic building blocks of corruption.
Nobody acts out of altruism when there's government money involved, especially the NGO sector, we've seen it so many times before, scam after scam, scandal after scandal.

Ahhhh, now I know why Lexi is so keen to knock Tony Abbott as PM !
It is left handed reasoning, as we will all then vote for Tony.
She thinks he will wreck the place and they will all leave.

Now there's an idea !

Dear SPQR,

I'm surprised that you've taken my previous post
so seriously.

Imagine if you would have thought
that I was merely being facetious.
Or that the author
was not trying to prove any point at all.
That
he was (with his tongue lodged firmly in his cheek)
being equally offensive to all parties by
pointing out the vanity and hypocrisy of
all our leaders, bureaucrats, journalists, and
party hacks on this issue.

No use imagining. Your reaction is always - what's
the word I'm looking for? Ah yes - strident -
and of course - predictable!

<< [He was] being equally offensive to all parties by
pointing out the vanity and hypocrisy of
all our leaders, bureaucrats, journalists, and
party hacks on this issue>>

All, you say!

Hmmm...funny, I don't seem to recall where he point-out/ hinted/ implied or anything else that the "asylum seekers" might be shonks/ frauds --I'll have to go back and look for that part.

As with most examples of the genre it seems everyone & everything is fair or unfair game except those poor dears the "asylum seekers".

The subtext being: It's all our fault--we should just grow-up and open up our borders to one an all!

The asylum seeker problem could easily be solved if the boat people had to go through all the bureaucratic nonsense as genuine visitors.

Individual,
The Asylum Seeker problem could most easily be solved by withdrawing from the U.N convention on refugees, the government has to give 12 months notice of their intention to quit and in the meantime they could suspend processing.
The Europeans and the UK already have contingency plans to close borders in the event of a crisis:

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2168367/Eurozone-crisis-UKs-borders-closed-refugees-Greece-countries-eurozone-collapses.html

Are we naive enough to believe that "Refugees from Greece" means real Greeks as opposed to the 3 million Pakistanis, Afghans, Turks, Africans and other non Europeans who reside in that country and who would be hardest hit by a financial crisis?

Jay of Melbourne,
Pointless dragging up the UN. If the UN did it's work there wouldn't be anymore refugees after so many years of UN.
The world really doesn't need a whole organisation just to close the gates after the horses have bolted. Beside the huge, immeasurable expense, effort & bad situations being fostered.

On Insiders this morning David Marr emphatically repeated several
times that Indonesia would simply refuse to accept any boats turned back.

I believe this is nonsense as the vessels are Indonesian and the crew
is Indonesian. The nationality of the passengers is irrelevant.

Anyone know if maritime law is different to that ?

If the Opposition is so concerned about asylum
seeker's "humanitarian rights," and that was the
reason they said they did not support the compromise
solution on offer in Parliament. They would only
support a deal where off-shore processing was done
in places that had signed the Refugee Convention.
Then how come Mr Abbott and his colleagues are quite
happy to tow the boats back to Indonesia which is
not a signatory to the Refugee Convention?

All this looks like a bit of a furphy. A political
ploy to win the next election - at any cost.

Also, Indonesia - will not accept the boats being
towed back - they've made that crystal clear.
Again - more furphy. Is Mr Abbott really wanting to
start an international incident with Indonesia.
And instead of having good neighbours - he wants to
create an enemy on our door-step. Good thinking on
the part of the Libs.

Lexi,

Comparing stopping the boats to sending children to Malaysia is trite. Turning the boats around in international waters is restoring them to the condition they were in a few hours before. Nearly half the boats that leave Indonesia are turned around by the Indonesians, would you extend this to asking the Indonesians to stop?

Until they land in Australia, they are not legally Australia's problem.

Why doesn't Australia help Indonesia turning back those boats before they get to Indonesia ?
Stop them before they become an issue there.

Very poor thinking on your part Lexi.
Returning them to Indonesia is returning them to a country they went to
of their own volition. They CHOSE to go to Indonesia, there can be no
complaint if they are returned there.

Individual, almost all, except a very few that come direct from Sri Lanka,
come from Indonesia. The passengers either flew to Malaysia or Indonesia.
They are the responsibility of those two countries.
After all they granted them entry.

It really is none of our business.

Bazz,
That was exactly my point. There aren't any boats before Indonesia. So how its it that they can enter these countries when they supposedly have no papers ? Try to go to these countries from here with no papers & see what happens. The point I'm making is that there is a concerted effort involving several countries to invade Australia by way of pretend refugees.
Too many Australians are really so blind to what's going on. I think we should send these pro boat people Australians to the countries to our North without papers.

Oh I see Individual. It was a bit obscure.
People have been pointing out that they must have destroyed their
passports on leaving Indonesia for years.
Unfortunately the pro boaties are uneducated about international
travel or want to avoid the question. I suspect the latter.
It is believed they get rid of their passports because it makes it more
difficult to return them to their home country.
Another suggestion I saw was that the smugglers demand the passports
so they can feed them into the false passport industry.
Some passports could be worth a lot of money.

Bazz,
Recently I heard that some are mailing their passports here to friends and relos, so they can use them latter when they gain permanent residence here and want to return to their homeland to tidy up their affairs there and bring out the remainder of their families.

Have you heard any confimation about that.

Not really Banjo, I did hear it once suggested and it does make sense.
That is one of the advantages of the TPV as if they leave the country
they cannot reenter.

Of course all the solutions we come up with are putting the cart before the horse, to really stop the boats we'd first have to make it a criminal offence to work as a lawyer, you can tweak legislation all you want but an injunction puts a stop to any solution, humane or otherwise.
The only way to stop the pro boaties and open borders people is to deny them access to the courts.

Well the precedent has been set now we have this "Australian and Indonesian search and rescue authorities are responding to the distress call from the boat believed to be 43 nautical miles south of West Java"
How long before they call from the pier saying we are setting out you can pick us up in an hour or so.
STOP giving them the 4 star treatment TPV only then send them home no documents no entry.

call from the pier saying we are setting out you can pick us up in an hour or so.
Philip S,
I'm surprised australian TV hasn't got a crew on the pier there for live updates..