No Lexi, it is not simple !
In an era of the end of growth we will not have the GDP to have the
ability and funds to build new plant.
Credit is only available if there is a capacity to repay plus interest.

We are not talking about a temporary problem, this is permanent !
Our difficulty will be maintaining existing facilities.
Quote;
The population of our cities is growing and for existing
services to cope with the increasing demand

Increasing existing services will not be possible, except for local
projects that local communities can undertake.
However you might be right there in that there might be a very large
increase in illegal immigrants due to collapse in marginal economies
in Asia. Offset against that could be travel difficulties.

To sum up, financial resources will be very tight from now on.
China has managed to corner much of the spare available energy with
long term contracts and by buying oil fields such as many in Africa.
To cope we have reduced our (developed countries) consumption.

Today Greece, tomorrow Italy, day after Spain, France and finally
Germany ?
Oil prices have eaten their GDP, are UK, US and Aus next ?

ps we import all our petrol and two refineries were recently closed.

Dear Bazz,

We'll have to agree to disagree on this issue.

You feel that we've been hard done by.

It's best to remember that we in Australia:
1) Have it better than almost everybody economically.
2) Pollute more than almost everybody.
3) Stand to suffer heavily from Climate Destabilisation.

The shape of the climate policy Australa is adopting
is in many respects stronger that the proposed CPRS.
The so called "gateway targets" are more stringent, the
industry compensation slightly less generous, the
mechanisms to adjust targets and compensation better.
Most importantly, there is a mandated floor price on
carbon for the first three years of the scheme. This
particular measure is looking farsighted, given the recent
collapse in international carbon markets owing to the
struggling European economy. As a result Australia now
enjoys one of the highest carbon prices in the world,
with one of the strongest policy architectures to ensure
the decarbonisation of our economy. The government has
thought this scheme through very well.

Once this scheme is implemented and has been up and running for
a while - you'll see for yourself that your fears were
totally unfounded. Of course I don't expect you to believe me.
But time will take care of that.

Cheers.

Sorry Lexi, we are talking about different subjects.
CO2 & global warming has nothing to do with what I was saying.
Carbon taxes etc etc are not relevant.

It does not matter what the floor price of carbon is or is not.

The subject is;
The price of energy is using up so much money that it has affected
countries ability to repay debt.

I suggest that you read this;

http://tinyurl.com/d2uhl49

Dear Bazz,

Apologies for the misunderstanding.

However it still does not change my point of view.
I don 't buy your dismal outlook.
Perhaps the following website may allay your concerns:

http://www.foreignminister.gov.au/speeches/2011/kr_sp_111025.html

The Australian Economy: National Economic Resilience in the Midst of
Global Economic Volatility.

Ahh yes Lexi, you might well be a politician with that belief.
You have indeed touched the crux of the problem with your ref link.
Many have gone before you;

"All will be fine, there is no problem that cannot be solved"
Jo Bejelke Petersen "Now don't you worry"

There are just two governments that do not hold your opinion.
The UK and Sweden. The UK last year had the Energy Dept do a report
on the problem. The report was immediately tucked away out of sight.
Unfortunately the Guardian got wind of it and made a Freedom of
Information request for it but was refused.
The Guardian had to take the government to court to get access.
It confirmed what was widely known already.

The same thing happened with the Hirsch report for the US Dept of
Energy but it was dug out by a group of school boys !

Politicians are not facing up to it as I think that they are unable
to see a palatable solution to present to the people when they lift the veil.
In our parliament there are three known realists, Minister Martin
Ferguson, Barnaby Joyce and Christine Milne. There are probably
others but they dare not speak its name.

No, 2008 GFC was the first shot and the present problem in Europe
is the second part.
What you express is a common reaction when people first consider
this problem. Look at the reaction to the Qantas grounding.
Unbelievable, terrible thing to do !
What do you think will be the reaction if airlines are grounded permanently ?

Now don't get me wrong that probably won't happen this decade, but
as the OECD's International Energy Authority has warned that we have
to find two more Saudi Arabias this decade.
There is absolutely no way that any alternative system will supply
that amount of energy. Not even nuclear could cover that. It is too late.

I can only suggest you start reading.
Quite a number of books available, but local bookshops do not seem
to have any, Amazon has most. My library has two.

Dear Bazz,

Thanks for sharing your point of view.
Much appreciated. I still feel though
that comparing the Australian economy to that
of the UK and the US is like comparing apples and oranges.

If you're after particular information your regional
or state library should be able to help you find the
material you're after. They can source information from
periodicals, conference proceedings, reports, catalogues,
and various databases. They can also help you with online
searching.

See you on another thread.