SM,

It's interesting from my point of view, in that my state doesn't allow revenue to be raised from pokies. So it's something that we don't have. It's interesting that because such reliance is made of this avenue in the other states, that it's removal is seen as an assault of some sort of freedom....just an observation.

Btw, my dad had a lot of bad habits, he drank and smoked and gambled. The drinking wasn't very pleasant on Saturday night, but the fallout from gambling lasted all week long and then was renewed in exactly the same fashion the following week. No money......

12% is the figure stated in federal Parliament , I except that.
My childhood seems a bit like yours Poirot.
I refuse to consider this Social reform issue a tool to bash Labor with.
Not approving of the two pushing the issue, maybe not sure federal Parliament is the place for it.
But NSW the first home of these machines is not only the home of clean tidy,acceptable venues to play these things.
Early opening pubs, dive best describes have them, people on drugs sit in front of them.
Desperation drives some boredom others crime plays a roll.
20% of first offending drug carriers.sellers say poker machine debt drove them to crime.
Politics? it baffles me, what is required from the party some follow?
Is there common ground.
Or just the need to beat the other side in to submission.
I request my party govern better, that it govern well,take on the hard issues, care for those who are not capable of doing it them selves.
I would happily throw every poker machine in the ocean, that is not linked to profits being returned to Social or sporting clubs.
Why let pubs get rich?
I think most conservatives share my view, are repelled by the defense of an industry run often by gangsters, for political gain?

2.3% is the figure from the Australian Bureau of statistics productivity report. Perhaps 12% is the number of people affected? Or the number that regularly gamble?

But from the sounds of it, you would simply like gambling banned.

Poirot, I am sorry about your dad, but would a pre commitment on some pokies stopped him from gambling?

Been 12 months but I had been a punter from my first pocket money day.
3 pence each way what ever Nevile Selwood rode in the first.
Then my cousin wed into the family of a jockey and I switched to his rides.
I understand gambling.
A bookmaker is no gambler he/she runs a book, based on mathematics knows they get a win no matter what the result.
All gambling is such.
Lost two thousand in a Casino won 26 thousand on a horse.
Alway winning some one Else's lost money.
Only book makers owners of venues who Gamble lost.
We are talking about poker machines.
not gambling in general, the figure is 12%
Not the sport of kings racing not any other form,we talk of a form of gambling that brings great pain to the very poorest.
And attempts to limit losses.
we discuss a lie
the tax on football lie, who of us will claim it is not a lie.
2013 this country changes government.
Not forever but for a time.
I see truly, that government in waiting,promising less tax much cost cutting even pensions.
If they consider opposition to things requiring our action, like this our country has dark days ahead.
Leave the clubs out, how did we let the very sleaziest of our pubs put in poker machines?
Western suburbs of Sydney a once drinking spot for me,now packed with poker machines and Social drop outs I was offered every thing from drugs to sex in the time it took to drink my last beer there, could have bought any stolen item I wanted if I would wait.
Should we protect that?

Belly,
I cannot remember when it was that pubs were able to install poker machines, maybe someone here will know. But it changed the whole atmosphere of pubs and I no longer frequent them and I doubt if I am the only one.

However, the problem for the government is do they acceed to Wilkies demand and if not will Wilkie drop his support as threatened. Another problem of this governments own doing and again we must question the judgement of Gillard in agreeing to this demand. Or will she do another turnabout and go back on her word.

Personally I have doubts about the effectiveness of a predetermined limit by a patron anyway. He will simply go to another venue or exit and return to get around the obstacle.

But the clubs and pubs are a powerfull industry and the government stands to lose a lot of votes if they acceed to Wilkies demand.

Like the illegal boat people and the failed Malaysian deal, this poker machine thing is Labors own problem and the Opposition can just sit back and watch.

http://www.smh.com.au/business/even-americans-shun-our-addictive-pokies-20110929-1kzfo.html
Banjo we are not far apart in most things.
Will you read this link with an open mind.
It in terms that can not be defended says 12 billion dollars is taken from these machines.
And 5 billion of that is from problem gamblers.
Do the sum tell me the percentages.
NOW I ask only this
Yes pubs are no longer worth the visit, mostly.
And again you from a different paddock than me, share my view Xenophon and Wilkie should not be in Parliament.
Mate use that mind.
Maybe not you but many, who hold fixed bigoted views,,, would embrace all the independents, love them all!
If it was the tiny man, focused on him,not his party not his country Abbott they sided with.
ARE WE unable to see
Can we be trusted to judge, this issue on truth?
These two men are not acting because of politics.
SURELY you see it is care that drives them?
Last I now offer my party's head on a stick, two brothers, both ex ministers in my state own a chain of these pubs.
In NSW.
NSW is home of sleazy pubs run by sleazy people and if conservatives can not think in terms of best interests of the country Abbott has inflicted wounds on a once far better party.
NSW ALP Governments let pubs own poker machines