Alas, here I was hoping I would get Pericles' thoughts on my analogy of the legalities of defamation of religion with detectable hate tones, and instead everyone jumped on him about our civilization/white race/stereotypes.

Because I think the issue of implicit and explicit demographic hate messages contained within a different from of expression is critical to this debate.

pericles, I never pretended to think that christian fundamentalists were any better or worse than muslims. But at least the PC crowd doesn't shout down any criticism of them. There's a message there.

As you acuse Wilders of hatred, how do you view the muslim mind-set with its 'convert or kill' philosophy to 'infidels'? The very post following yours, from SPQR, details some of the muslim hate-mantra from their odious koran.

I see that you never denied your hatred of whites, christians, and especially white christians. Instead, you resort to an infantile comment involving baby kittens and chocolate biscuits. Great debating from an intellectual giant! I suppose if you can't argue with logic, stupidity is your fall-back position. How pathetic.

I'm sorry I can't measure up to your high standard of debate, Ms Powerless.

>>I suppose if you can't argue with logic, stupidity is your fall-back position. How pathetic.<<

How does it go again, this logic of yours?

>>I reckon you hate whites, christians, and especially white christians. There's no place for you and your kind in this country.<<

Ah yes. With such superhuman mental processes lined up against me, no wonder I resorted to personal references.

But I was right about the choccy-bikkies, wasn't I?

C'mon, you can admit it. You're among friends.

"Atheists heart Muslims"
That's what should be on a t-shirt/bumper sticker.

Yet again, we have atheists (Pericles) defending Muslims, then jumping to another page to attack Christians!

I've seen this hypocrisy-topped-with-a-double-standard-cherry a lot lately and it boggles the mind.

If someone made a film that quoted the Bible, over images of witch-hunts and inquisitions, would this be "vilification" or just a presentation of FACTS?

Pericles, comparing Wilders with the vaguely-alluded-to-but-not-named Hitler?
Hitler made stuff up about Jews.
You don't need to with Muslims.
Wilders and other critics refer to the real words, real actions of real people.

Real scriptures, real speeches, real murders, real massacres, real riots.
No need to make stuff up.

Wilders is defending freedom.
Many Muslims have no interest in doing so.
If they don't openly reject liberal values, they remain silent in the company of those that do.

No, not *every* Muslim is going to be a threat.
But there is clear enough evidence of a widespread anti-Western-ism in the Islamic world, that those people should be off-limits for immigration, at least until signs of *reform* are seen.

Islam has never been wanted in our civilisation, and for an atheist to run to their defence is utterly absurd.

You need to ask yourself what your values really are, and what kind of society you want our descendents to inherit from us.

Shockadellic this is by far the dumbest stereotype I have yet read;
"Atheists heart Muslims"

Might I point out that I am an atheist and *I* have been defending Mr Wilders in this debate).

In fact, I would have much more grounds to say "Christians heart Muslims" as far more Christian representatives keep wanting to find some kind of theological common ground with Muslims, while most atheists speaking on behalf of atheism are staunchly in opposition to Islam (as the common ground between a practicing Muslim and an atheist are far less than between two practicing religious people).

Your stereotype is so horribly flimsy and false you only make yourself look bad by introducing it to the thread.

That's simply an indication of how confused you are, Shockadelic

>>we have atheists (Pericles) defending Muslims<<

If you care to read what I wrote, instead of what you think I wrote, I was addressing the point at which a defence of "free speech" is actively employed to further the political ambitions of a white supremacist.

>>If someone made a film that quoted the Bible, over images of witch-hunts and inquisitions, would this be "vilification" or just a presentation of FACTS?<<

Depends how it was done. You couldn't exactly categorize Wilders' work as documentary, could you. So it is a matter of degree. In my view he went way over the line, into pure rabble-rousing territory.