Regarding the death penalty, it does deter crime.
Those that are executed never commit another crime and regarding those executed who were later found to be innocent, this is a fault of process not of the punishment as such.

Ammonite I do consider incarceration without the possibility of release as a form of cruelty. At best the incarcerated should always have the option of an early end to it in as painless a manner as possible. Other alternatives seem to be about retribution rather than the wellbeing of society.

I've also got serious concerns about keeping people incarcerated who remain an ongoing genuine risk to others (guards, prisoners etc). There comes a point where execution looks like the least barbaric option.

As you have so well pointed out keeping an open mind on issues is not always easy.

R0bert

just as you can only
know what you know

sometimes its just more important
to listen..than be heard

as we know..the system knows well
how to protect itself

""Maybe one day Arjay
you can tell us we were all wrong
if more information comes to light,"""

lol..see how people talk..like im not even here
the info is all there...but..[it is only found..by looking]

and never found...if the powers that keep secrets want it to not be found

""but if it doesn't
it also remains much more difficult
to prove no conspiracy to people who have already made up their minds.""

they are luckey
its not till more of you
feel the omnipotant forces
move against your thinking..

and try to shut you down,
by ridicules
incarceration..
phyc testing..jail..fire..theft..
disinfranchising you from family friends/peers and society

only then will they join us
with some really strange new theory

but hey we heard them all..
but go ahead..speak
we are listening

but first..
ya got any proof?

oh they kept it
who is they?

lol

i got disconected from web
just trying to post this

of course it happens a few times each time i go online
that and extreemly slow computer..or partial downloads

but hey thats just dodo being a bad server...
not that they read our posts as we type..in real time
but why would they bother..im only repeating things others say

personally i only know
the known knowns that i know
be thankfull you dont have a driving/need..to know[or worse be heard]

far easier to be herd
baaaa baaaa baaa
[just teasing]

ok still not posting
ok try my post quick
[on a new page trick]

Yabby never fear the very left fill a phone box at the ALP conference.
You will be pleased to know once in that box no one, not one of the three of them, knows how to get out.
I think we should enjoy this.
Truly ROTFL funny stuff.
The lefter than left just love being wrong generations of them, so many its a wounder their kids had two feet.
Always hopping around one foot in their mouths then saying it was not me mate!
ww2 Russia stayed out at first, Comrades even did not want to load troops suplys.
Germany invades Russia??
Here think about this do please, the mass murderers lie so much you can tell.
Watch one on TV the second his/her mouth opens you will know they are lieing.
The leader of thes4e mass murdering hate filled enslavers of women, need not worry our lefty will love him or Satan before America

*Yabby never fear the very left fill a phone box at the ALP conference*

Belly, yup I know that. The extreme left are part of the Greens
these days. You then have those that actually care about the
environment and the radical left, all flying the Green flag, as
they have none other to fly.

My questions to Poirot were for a different reasons. I enjoy
her posts and think she is not silly, just deluded :)

Arjay and UOG are different altogether, completely off the planet.
At least I can read Arjay's posts, but I seldom bother with UOG,
so just skip to the next post.

As to America, I am not always pro America. I was not pro Bush's
America, but I think that Obama's America is different and he
shows good judgement.

There was an interesting article today in the West, about the
compound where bin Laden lived. 3m high walls, no visitors ever,
no telephone or internet, no rubbish ever put out, all was burned
within. Only the best of everything was bought, paid in cash, never
credit. Food for about 10 people went in on a regular basis.

The people who lived there had no contact with anyone from the
town, over the 5 years or so.

I very much agree about Piriot and a few who are at this stage of their lives greens.
Remember I too walked in the paddock greens now flounder in, just as sure I was right.
And looking for just the same, idealistic things we can never have.
We humanity, warts and all, can only be what we always are, some times right some times wrong.
In the background ABC Late line is letting a person say Bin Ladin was murdered.
Tell me folks was 9/11 a mass murder? no arjay the insanity of your claims is not selling.
Do human bombs murder or just fight a war of Independence.
Now last the out right blinding lie used like an AK47 every time some in this area speak, Pakistan's whole fabrications every word a lie , are we to judge America badly but not these?
Dick, who shoots his Friends OUG is long gone, has no roll in this and mate surely you know that.
Please let us ask future human bombs explain just before murdering what they are.