Spindoc please excuse me for being honest.
Your opinions have been of no worth to me for some time.
I rather value a more honest style,for almost every day I have posted here, I have taken the stick to NSW Labor, no doubt you did not mind that.
But when I high light my views, conservatives after the honeymoon will be bad you get offensive.
It is true handle is flogging a dead rat, not horse but rats,this election result is not a conservative victory.
It is self mutilation by the ALP my party.
Wonder IF EVER you SPIN DOC could bring your self to say that about your side, say Abbott who drags this country's politics down in to the sewer?
Handle you do more harm than good, on this issue it is ALP members/voters who are chucking us out.

Belly, you say "Wonder IF EVER you SPIN DOC could bring your self to say that about your side"

Now I know where you are going wrong. I don't have a "side". I call incompetence, failure, lies and ideology as I see it from all perspectives. No political persuasion has the divine right to be "right or wrong". All they have to do is make it work, not fail.

If you beleive the ALP has it right thats fine, just don't try to dress up your search for an exit plan as a change of heart because you don't need a reason to support the ALP, you just do.

a party like the Liberals -to my mind elitist, contrary in interests to the vast majority and a better friend to big business than it is to any average voter.
Handle,
First of all people with sense don't vote liberal, they vote coalition. Do you mean elitist contrary to the vast majority such as Judges, lawyers, Uni Professors & Academics ?
The coalition is pro business for the simple reason that it is business which keeps the ball rolling, not those who live off our taxes & then treat us with contempt. Business employs the vast majority & pays this majority for their efforts. What return do you get from academics for your dollar ?
People of the left expect goods & services provided by business but condemn business for producing them.
A littlebit insipid I'd say.

Spindoc a question.
Do you consider your self intelligent?
Would you like OLO readers to?
Are you aware of my thread here about after this election.
Did you see my one about power sell off of two years ago.
Have you read any of my post history .
My disgust with NSW Labor is here from 2005.
My WISH! for the party to be flogged in this election is too.
I have debated this, will I vote national [my seat is held by them], or greens.
Now in the game of verbal tennis one rule remains true always, truth out ways the product of the southern end of a north bound BULL.
Your proposition that I am fishing for an excuse for LABOR is not intelligent comment, is it?
Look at my post history as I did yours, spindoc think about it before posting .

Thought about my last post all night.
I hold myself accountable for every post.
Some times I think deeply truly and honestly I should stop posting.
One day I will.
I can not help being heated for me OLO is educational a chance to see what others think.
A chance to say what ever we want to.
It also,for me,is a chance to skate on thin ice,say just what I do think about my side of politics.
What I think,what I have said separates me from my lifetime loves the ALP and AWU,I could well be forgotten ,for loving both enough to say it like it is.
And the dark side of unionism.
Still clinging to the idea honesty and review builds both groups strengths.
I would never find a home in leftist forums, no mirrors exist there, just follow the leader cuddle the devil stuff.
But this badly educated but learning man see,s a fault in a few like spin doc and the others know who they are.
A need to run away from truth, slander for its sake, to jump in to print without learning about the subject or people.
I ask too much, some clearly do not have the ability to do other than paint the side they follow white and mine black.
Some where in between exists thoughts that may just take this country to better governments and better opposition.

Belly, “do I consider myself intelligent and would I like OLO readers to?”

Educated? Yes, for what that’s worth.
Intelligent? Can’t define it, can you?
OLO readership views? As long as I can challenge the thinking of others with reality I will continue to embrace the opportunity, opinion of my intelligence is irrelevant because no one can define intelligence.

More importantly I consider myself a realist. I have difficulty understanding how and why Australian’s, who are noted for their pragmatism, still subscribe to “tribal politics”.

You have indeed criticized the ALP; you have questioned many of their policies and you have expressed concerns about the “backroom shenanigans”. Your disgust however, seems to be focused upon the damage they have done to your beloved ALP and AWU. So rather than review the reasons for your tribal alignment, you seek refuge in a “similar” disposition in the Nationals or Greens.

To which I would suggest, that I expect that our government of the peoples’ choice, should be capable of formulating, costing, implementing and justifying policy that is balanced and beneficial to all Australians against the needs of the Nation at that time. The next question I would ask myself is which political persuasion or combination is best equipped to achieve this. If in my view, that was the ALP/Independent/Greens coalition, I would indeed vote for it.

And yes, I did vote for Bob Hawke and I do think his government met the criteria by which I judged his performance.

Unfortunately, at the last election and in spite of the loss of its majority, a cobbled together government has emerged that is now utterly compromised and is incapable of delivering against my criteria for effective governance.

If you cannot align the principles and ideology of your tribal politics with what is on offer, you have the same choices as every other Australian. You can align yourself with the next best failing tribe or you can vote for change. Whining about the “failings” of your tribe and trying to lay blame won’t cut it