"It is when they try to mix it with main stream that they get picked on."

By a pathetic 4% who, if the same is true for Transgender as it is known to be for gays, 84% of that 4% are themselves self-hating transgender people in denial (based on scientific studies that found most homophobes got sexually aroused when shown gay erotica)

That being picked on is new. It's learned behaviour that came from concerted attempts to destroy Transgender traditions and stamp out this Genetic human trait. (oh and Australian Scientists discovered one of those Transgender genes!)

"After all, it is not the 'norm' and that's simply a fact."

Rubbish. It's not average but then neither are many things that are normal. It's found in every society on earth. It's genetic. It was recently respected in much of the world including Australia. It will never go away and we know society has accepted it before and so can do again. People tried to demonise it and stamp it out with lies so it went into hiding so it seems not-normal but that will only last so long as it's kept in the closet just like women with opinions etc.

The closet causes psychological harm and kills. You just advocated for death of some Transgender people so that some bigots don't have to get over a temporary discomfort of getting used to the proven scientific and historical fact that Transgender people are part of Australia. You just gave in to terrorism, i'm sure Al Qaeda would leave us alone if we all converted to Wahabist Islam and keep any other view in the closet.

If you disagree with converting to Wahabism then why should Transgender people submit to a small group of terrorists who use violence to try and keep them in the closet? Why shouldn't the Police and Schools and Politicians do their job to protect Transgender people the way they do other minorities?

Heck with a 3%-10% chance you have crossdresser family and/or friends! Suffering because a couple hundred years ago bigots in power tried to exterminate Transgender and even 40 years ago people were electrocuting them and labotomising them here in Australia in failed attempts to 'cure' them, after a good police bashing first of course.

C'mon rechtub. Thats irrational and unjust. I already described the simple answer to this particular case, a transgender prison. Just reorganise one existing prison. Easy and cheap. And we clearly need an anti-violence campain for those few bigots who can't keep their fists to themselves. We already do those, just not for the people who need it the most. We investigate deaths in custody too, just not for transgender women put into maximum security mens prisons, it's easy to fix that too.

rechtub get used to Transgender people. There's what? 2 million of them in this country? And more of them are demanding to be treated as Equal Australians. What the heck can be wrong with that?

Stop being gutless and making excuses for the current injustice. Reform is needed, it is right, it is simple, it is possible. So stop supporting the current injustice and instead support fair just reform.

Nothing to say rechtub? You surprise me. Don't you care about justice?

Here's some recent USA examples of the unequal treatment in prisons and by police Transgender people suffer. http://aebrain.blogspot.com/2010/09/see-pattern-here.html

C'mon rechtub. All I'm suggesting is actual equal fair treatment. Which would mean equal jail time for equal crime. And crime-prevention. Why can't you support that? Was all this really just an excuse to try and talk bad about Crossdressers and imply Transgender people got a better go than others when instead they get false arrests, misstreatment and uninvestigated deaths in custody? If you really wanted real justice wouldn't you agree to having a seperate Transgender prison? Yet you aren't saying that. And you have avoided responding to every injustice against Transgender people i have pointed out. Why is that rechtub?

BM, sorry I have been away for a few days, however, I see you have managed to keep yourself ammussed.

Boy I have really hit a nerve, hey!

I say again, WHO CARES!

Clearly you do care. You start a conversation railling against a perceived injustice, but to an actual solution you say "who cares?" and when shown that there are injustices that make the one you complained about pale into insignificace you reply "who cares?". Obviously you care, enough about justice to say you want justice and you care enough about the existance of Transgender people to then look as if you only want justice for Cisgender people and want injustice for Transgender people. And if not then you have missrepresented yourself. Gloating about "hitting a nerve" when I'm talking about peoples deaths? Is that really the way you want to look?

What is it preventing you rechtub from engaging with the injustices and the deaths and the assaults i reported to you in the same way that you were able to engage with the perceived injustice that started the conversation off?

Don't sully yourself with attempts to shirk looking square at this issue by trying to dissmiss me or the lives of those killed, driven to suicide or bashed and stabbed. It will only make you publicly look a hypocrite if you start a conversation on injustice and then try and wash your hands of it and laugh it off. I know it can be difficult when faced with a reality you didn't realise existed or which you had false preconceptions about and the reflex can be to stick your head in the sand or to try and find ways to dissmiss having to face the subject. But that would do you no credit as a human being rechtub.

If you care about justice and think Transgender should not be an issue interfering in justice, and yet it is so as my examples prove, then logic demands you should care about stopping it being an issue, by ending the injustices done to Transgender people. If you don't care about justice then you would not have started this discussion. So why exactly are you shrinking from the only logical conclusion? Transgender people's lives should matter to you as much as anyone elses.

Transgender people's lives should matter to you as much as anyone elses.

Well, sorry, but they don't.

Now, as for you trying to turn this whole on to me, well, let me remind you that I have made several points very clear.

Point 1. I don't see why anyone should be treated any differntly by the courts.

Point 2. I don't think that death by accident warrents jail. Remember, I was only reacting to a news story.

Point 3. Not yet made, but, if you think joe average cares so much about so few, then why not suggest a referendem on the subject. However, I don't like your chances.

Finally, you made mention of TS people dating back to before Australian white settlement.

Now I have no reason to doubt this, however, it is only in the last few decades that these types have openly come out of the closet.

Now, for some reason they want all others to accept them for what they are, well, that's simply not going to happen, at least not in my life time and you had best get used to it.

Now, if you wish to debate issues that effect our future, as a whole, then bring it on.