thinker 2,

Where the research seems to have inconsistencies and conflict it is possible it is caused by the difference between research where minimal amounts are often used to identify effect and the clinical records of ill or disturbed people admitted to hospitals. The latter would be using high doses and probably exhibited other problems before using cannabis.

Frankly I wouldn't mind having the option of a little 'grow your own' for relief later on for some of the inevitable problems of ageing. Not to grow old disgustingly although that is an inviting idea but to make the days more tolerable when the pains (and feelings of loss) kick in. Cheap and would go with over-loud Stones LPs - grey power!

Thinker2, I have no problems with your own feelings on the subject, however, it is already well known that people under the influence of alcohol should not be allowed to work at any job.

My opinion is not just based on the Australian Health Department website, although on a subject such as illicit drugs, I can't see why the health dept would put out the wrong info.

All the suggestions of ill-effects of dope smoking etc were mainly only 'possible' side effects. Not all people experience the same medical/mental problems as others after indulging in what is, after all, an illegal drug as it stands in Australia today.

People like our own lovely Antiseptic are breaking the law, and seem proud of it. Says alot about the man really.

I have unfortunately had to deal personally with people who have had severe reactions to smoking/ ingesting dope.

It is a well known fact in the medical profession that marijuana is at the very least, a dangerous precursor to some mental health disorders.

But hey, what do we know? We just work with the awful results.

Suzeonline:"It is a well known fact in the medical profession that marijuana is at the very least, a dangerous precursor to some mental health disorders."

Then you must be able to point to the research that shows this to be a fact? You know, double-blind studies that show an actual causal relationship? Oops, so much for that "fact", eh? What you meant to say was "I don't like pot, so there!".

What is a fact is that some people are so disillusioned with or poorly served by the medical profession's offerings that they choose to self-medicate. Perhaps if the medical profession, especially the psychiatric branch, was more concerned about outcomes for their patients those people who choose to self-medicate would be supported rather than treated like naughty children and guinea pigs for the next untested medicament from Pfizer, which seems to be your own preferred approach. I pity those poor buggers who might find themselves in your ward.

In the meantime, those of us who aren't psychotic also enjoy a smoke.

Severin:"I note the hour of your last post "

Yes, I am an early riser. I use the early hours to prepare for the day's work. Saw blades are re-tipped, chains are sharpened, emails are checked, fluids topped up, etc. Strangely, when I was a lad, early-rising was regarded as a virtue )"early to bed and early to rise makes a man healthy, wealthy and wise") but I can see that for those who make their living from a Government handout such a habit would be looked at askance.

>>> Yes, I am an early riser. I use the early hours to prepare for the day's work. Saw blades are re-tipped, chains are sharpened, emails are checked, fluids topped up, etc. Strangely, when I was a lad, early-rising was regarded as a virtue )"early to bed and early to rise makes a man healthy, wealthy and wise") but I can see that for those who make their living from a Government handout such a habit would be looked at askance. <<<

Anti

Diddums.

If not for you this world would cease to function and go spinning off into the cosmos. Not wonder you need a spliff by lunchtime.

Tell me, do you rest on the 7th day?

Not a thought for medicos, police, farmers, truckies and many more who keep our nation functioning. It is ALL about you isn't it Anti?

I'll tell my elderly mother to return her War Widow's pension, despite her working and paying her share of taxes, you regard people like her as "those who make their living from a Government handout".

You are not the only person who works hard. While I agree with your stance on illegal drugs, I will never condone the disdain with which you treat others on this forum.

I can disagree with others, as I have with Pelican and Suzeonline, unlike you, I know they will not take my differing POV as a personal affront and fill their posts with the poison that you regularly spray over others.

Awaiting your next supercilious swipe. You have no idea how much your unnecessary insults discredit whatever reasonable points you have to make. As an advocate for the legalisation of cannabis, you make a good wowser.

Thanks Severin and Suze.

Btw the excerpts and links with research sources that I provided are from the Australian Medical Association and the Royal College of Psychiatrists, but few addicts (of any substance) can view the evidence and weight of professional opinion objectively. Rationalizations and self-justifying defences must prevail. There's no sneaky motive; nothing to be gained by identifying the deletrious effects of mj use. Health and welfare providers get all the biz they need regardless of how psychoses and mood disorders, motor vehicle accidents, family breakdown and whatnot occur.

It's then not just a matter of the addicts' individual rights and freedoms, but of the rights and freedoms of people who have to deal with the effects (families especially) and of the cost to society generally. One of those costs is to young people who might try it and probably like it, then read the utter rubbish espoused by devotees that encourage it, and who are then more susceptible to the effects of the various chemicals on the developing brain.

I am advocating that in some way the money going to maintaining the drug biz instead be channeled into welfare and health costs and especially, the costs of rehabilitation for those who are willing to use it.

As I said, personally I am really fed up with seeing the claims of harmlessness, while trying to deal with the endless stream of people struggling to cope with the effects, and their families and carers who really just don't know how to live with someone whose moods turn into rages; who can't heat soup without making a mess; who is generally oblivious to personal responsibility for self care. If mopping up the mess left by addicts' personal choices and rights makes me a busy body, let it be understood that I am a VERY BUSY body - it would be nice not to be :)

Antiseptic <" Then you must be able to point to the research that shows this to be a fact? You know, double-blind studies that show an actual causal relationship? Oops, so much for that "fact", eh? What you meant to say was "I don't like pot, so there!"."

Actually, I do have proof...how about the British Medical Journal studies? Check out the website for yourself:

http://web.lemoyne.edu/~hevern/storiedconduct/files/Cannabis%20and%20psychosis.html

"A new meta-analysis published in British medical journal, The Lancet, argues that the use of cannabis is not at all an innocent pleasure. Rather, in a review of the combined results of 35 population-based longitudinal observational studies of the relationship between the use of cannabis and psychiatric disorders in later life, the authors found an overall increased risk of 41% in the development of any psychosis among individuals who had used marijuana in the past."

Apparently it was during the free-sex-and-drugs days of the 1960's and 1970's in America that many non-medical people 'decided' that marijuana was mainly harmless.
The medical profession never agreed with the hippies on that one.

Hmmmm......who to believe- The Lancet (British Medical Journal), or dope-smoking brain addled Antiseptic?