It seems to me that the current internecine battles in the Liberal party are in some ways deliberate.

HOCKEY is clearly setting him self up to become the leader of and Nick Minchim is a well known plotter and shrewd schemer. I don't think it's by accident that he's now trying to scuttle the deal on ETS.

He is IMO is looking to a double dissolution. There seems to be four obvious alternatives .
- Tip out Turnbull so to maximise the honeymoon for the new leader (Hockey?).
- Or the take Turnbull to a losing election then replace him.
- There is a feeling within the Libs that they can win a Double Dissolution on border control and thus avoid the split with the Country Party ( National Party (sic)).

Minchin clearly believes that the public can be persuaded that AGW isn't a big deal thus delaying any action only doing anything to match the world's worst. (pro the current business Status Quo elite.)

What do all these machinations say about the Liberal Party's 'values,
Power first?

NB If the tables were reversed I would be challenging the Labor party.
I distrust all PARTY political motives.

So, while all this pathetic in-fighting rabble goes on and on, attention is being diverted from the issues that really matter.
And the direction that the Libs desperately need to adopt if they are ever going to win power; a direction that is very different to Krudd's current maximised growthist agenda and that is essential for the preservation of a decent quality of life in this country, doesn't even get a look-in!

There is just no sign at all that Hockey or Minchin or anyone else would do any better than Turnbull, either for their party of for the country.

How very sad.

Ludwig
What convinces you that the Libs don't have exactly the same over all agenda?

Both parties fight over the middle 5-10% of the swinging votes. Basically that mean's business as usual, perhaps a different letter head and the tea lady and the cleaner are out sourced and the same (metaphoric) debt level exists....same poor performing Govt.

If Minchin gets his way it will business as usual. much as I dislike the man's attitudes Minchin is no fool. He is wedded to no AGW and pro growth and the same Economics(Magic Pudding syndrome).

Xammy, the Libs DO have the same agenda! The differences between them and the Kruddites is piffling.

For as long as they uphold this stupid 'me-tooist' crap, they'll remain an in-fighting opposition party!

And Rudd will continue to get away with the WORST political philosophy (that of the most incredible large-scale never-ending expansionism) that this country has ever seen.

agreed that the Liberal party is a mess under Turnbull. He is more to the left and as naive when it comes to climate change as Mr Rudd. What is absolutely pathetic is that it is obvious that not all Labour is stupid enough to believe in gw yet not one has got the guts to come out with it.

Dear Examinator,

Politicians will say one thing and
often do something totally different
always having an explanation for why
they changed their position or even
sometimes claiming, "that wasn't what
I said."

Therefore the denials coming from Joe Hockey,
and Nick Minchin at present regarding any
leadership challenges to Malcolm Turnbull
must be taken with a grain of salt...
In other words, "We shan't challenge the
current Leadership if we can come up with
another important measure necessary to win
the next election."

The reality is - it could be worse - instead of
Joe Hockey - you could have an Abbot or a Bishop,
right?

It could happen of course that Turnbull will get
sick and tired of all this in-fighting amongst
the party members and just up and quit.

However, the problems won't go away. A new Leader
will still faced with the same issues that Turnbull
is currently facing - the ETS has to be voted on -
(better sooner than later) - and a disunited Party
won't stand much of a chance with the Electorate.

It looks as if the PM and his Government may be in
for another term, unless Turnbull can get
his colleagues to work as a team - and present
a serious challenge.

I wish him luck - or at least - better Party support.
he'll need it to put the Party back on track.