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I see I've struck a nerve.

You say "Shadow Minister, who has referred to 10s of thousands of refugees on boats, has been everything *BUT* right"

Perhaps you would care to show where I predicted this. Or do you just make up things as you go along?

Considering that your prediction was "As the current controversy draws to a close, the opposition will be even less popular than ever" you are hardly a shining beacon in the field of political analysis.

I posted on the basis of political strategy which requires a step back from the sentimentality of the issue, and if you wish to debate this with me, I suggest you grow a pair and let reality shine into your emotionally clouded thought processes.

If you actually bother to read what I have written, you will see that I express greater concern for the 99% of refugees whose plight is more desperate than the boat people who have been making a living in Indonesia (un-persecuted) and who have $15000 ready cash to come here.

For example, if teenagers can relatively easily access a construction site, and in doing so injure themselves, the site owners are held responsible.

Similarily, Labor has created the environment where people take the perilous journey. The smugglers are directly responsible, but labor cannot avoid some liability.

Labor has slipped from a 16 point lead (landslide) a month ago to a 2 point lead (wafer thin) in the 2 party preferred polls. That's not my opinion either. Where will the polls be next month or 6 months from now.

Note that this is occurring as interest rates shoot up, and the other prong of the coalition attack on Labor begins to bite, people will start to feel insecure, and Labor having been in power both federally and in most of the states for some time, will have no one else to blame.

Bronwyn worries what the rest of the world will think we are terrible
people if the final upshot is not to the liking of the asylum seekers.

Bronwyn, if the world doesn't like the result let them take them in !
I bet that will change their tune.

Global warming and/or peak oil will change our rules very quickly.
We will not be able to consider an increase in population.
It will be impossible. Sooner or later we will withdraw from the
refugee treaty along with a number of other countries. It might not
be for ten years but it will happen.
What Europe is seeing now is but the early signs.
It could even reach; no I won't write that as I am not sure that
many of those here could contemplate what I foresee.
Remember what I wrote a while back about 10,000 ton ships turning
up in Sydney Harbour or Perth ?
Thats where it will go if it gets out of hand,
Think business plans.

Shadow Minister: "There is nothing stopping him hopping on a ferry to the mainland and applying for housing etc, even before his asylum status is verified."

That may be true, but as Bronwyn points out the practical effect of this change is small. And we are all about practicalities here aren't we Shadow? Scoring political points for our side isn't a consideration.

Shadow Minister: "The drubbing that Labor got in the polls indicates that I am not the only one that thinks this way."

So the talking heads say. But since the poll didn't ask about asylum seekers they were just filling an information vacuum with hot air. I can't blame them. That is what they are paid to do. I try not to pay them too much attention though. Several notable things happened in that fortnight: the solar hot water subsidy was scrapped without notice, Costello was appointed to the Future Fund, Rudd said he was all in favour of Australia doubling its population, and of course this asylum seeker thing. With so many possibilities, unlike talk heads and you I am loath pick out a single cause.

But if I were I die hard Liberal supporter, I'd be hoping it wasn't the asylum seeker issue. For all his faults, Rudd is a capable administrator, and given enough time he will put that issue to bed. As it happens he does have the time. Undoing his comments on population would be harder, as he left himself no wiggle room. Nothing short of a full backflip with pike would work. So if I were you I'd be hoping it was the population comments.

Shadow Minister: "plight is more desperate than the boat people who have been making a living in Indonesia (un-persecuted)"

You didn't see the news today eh? The bit about them being beaten, and drinking from wells contaminated with human faeces. Still, this is undeniably a winning strategy, Shadow. It is so much easier to pass glib judgements about others in support of your position if you avoid knowing the facts. Howard proved that.

Hmm, I see I've struck several nerves with Shadow Minister.

Nice little swifty you tried to pull there SM; luckily, you can't go back and change your posts. Here's what you wrote, "we accept that we will get 10s of thousands of people on boats, then we would believe him". And to put your quote in EXACT context.......Your quote was in reference to, if Mr Rudd had said "we accept that we will get 10s of thousands of people on boats" then we would believe him.

So there it is. Shadow Minister, in an earlier post, showed he believes 10s of thousands of boat people "will" be coming. Typical fear mongering.

Nice bit of denial with your above post SM. Better luck next time. As I always say, peoples' "language" always eventually betrays their motives and/or real beliefs.

Also, in the above post SM openly admits he posts on this topic on the basis of political "strategy"........ he sees it as a game, it's just political spin to him. Unfortunately he doesn't seem to possess the maturity and insight to understand that refugees on boats and asylum seekers on boats are actually HUMAN BEINGS. He adopts the tactics of the uninformed, or deliberately attempts to mislead, (it's either one or the other) in order to present the idea that boat people are well off, economic asylum seekers who are in no danger either back in their own countries and who suffer no disadvantage by spending up to 15 years or so in concentra......... oops, I mean "refugee" holiday camps.

Oh well, let the demonisation of boat people on this site continue.

Bronwyn,
Be assured that I participate in these threads because people of an open mind might read them. They are entitled to get a factual view of what illegals are about, not just the romantic spin and propaganda put forward by those encouraging illegal entrance to Aus.

Fact. The Tampa was hijacked by those that she rescued, Captains evidence, under oath, stated he was concerned for safety after threats were made and altered course to Christmas Island, which was not his chosen destination. That dear Bronwyn is hijacking by any standard and those making the threats should have been held accountable.

Fact. The 78 on board the Oceanic Viking are preventing her from going about her normal business. That also could be considered hijacking. At best, the 78 would be termed 'squatters' and should be removed. The world is watching and we would be seen to be fair but strong in giving the 78 two weeks before removing them.

Any fair and normal person would be thankfull to the rescuers and be eternally gratefull. Not these frauds.

An intention to seek asylum does not give persons any right to flaunt a countries laws about entry. They cannot go willy nilly where ever they like. Until such time as they actually apply for protection they are unlawful or illegal entrants. DIAC Refers to them as such.

The difference between the success rate for the illegals and those that arrive legally, and applying for asylum, is simply because the illegals cannot be sent home and this is acheived by them destroying all their docs. Their home country will not take them back without verification. That is why they destroy their papers and identies.

And so the inaccurate demonisation of boat people continues.